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Mirages being turned into ew ac

Reichmarshal

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This guy is claiming that some mirages, whose airframes have some life left in them, are being turned into ew ac with easa radars n all...with chinese help......now if true then that be somthing but then again knowing how much PAF loves these mirages n the current chief is a mirage rider himself, i wouldn't be too suprised.

Don't mind the chaps accent 🙂

 
Can mirages even house aesa radar? I think only mirage 3 could house a small aesa radar. Do mirage engines even produce enough power for them to be a new aircraft?
What would it cost to turn these old aircraft into ew aircraft? Is it economically feasible to even turn them into ew aircraft?
Does mirage airframe have enough space to put ew equipment in? If not does it need airframe modifications to add it or will it be ew pods it will carry? If it’s ew pods won’t that mean only centreline pod can be used?
Won’t extensive re wiring be needed to make it an ew aircraft?
How much extra weight will be added and can mirage deal with the extra weight?
If mirages are turned into ew aircraft then what’s the reason why they weren’t being retired? Weren’t the main reasons the munitions it could carry and the range it had? Converting them into ew aircraft means it can’t be PAF’s bomb truck anymore.
Wouldn’t it just be more feasible to make ew version of JF-17B?
What’s the risk of putting such expensive ew equipment into such risky old airframes?

This news is most likely fake. It just doesn’t make sense to invest anything more into those old aircraft.
 
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This guy is claiming that some mirages, whose airframes have some life left in them, are being turned into ew ac with easa radars n all...with chinese help......now if true then that be somthing but then again knowing how much PAF loves these mirages n the current chief is a mirage rider himself, i wouldn't be too suprised.

Don't mind the chaps accent 🙂


Silly idea by some rando on Youtube hoping to harvest ad-revenue .. please ignore !!! There is no life left in the Mirages for them to take on a new life doing anything else other than going away and retiring.
 
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This guy is claiming that some mirages, whose airframes have some life left in them, are being turned into ew ac with easa radars n all...with chinese help......now if true then that be somthing but then again knowing how much PAF loves these mirages n the current chief is a mirage rider himself, i wouldn't be too suprised.

Don't mind the chaps accent 🙂


Just imagine there is a 1980's Honda and someone is trying to put a 1-ton Radar on it. :lol: Let's be honest, these Mirages which Pakistan Military is using are garbage aircrafts and are obsolete. In fact, these clowns just do not want to fund new jets because they are too busy with loot and plunder. And every now and then these looters just release such fairy tales news so that ordinary people can be lied to about how wonderful PAF is performing.

These jets do not BELONG IN 2023 AND BEYOND, THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN SCRAPPED DECADES AGO.
 
Can mirages even house aesa radar? I think only mirage 3 could house a small aesa radar. Do mirage engines even produce enough power for them to be a new aircraft?
What would it cost to turn these old aircraft into ew aircraft? Is it economically feasible to even turn them into ew aircraft?
Does mirage airframe have enough space to put ew equipment in? If not does it need airframe modifications to add it or will it be ew pods it will carry? If it’s ew pods won’t that mean only centreline pod can be used?
Won’t extensive re wiring be needed to make it an ew aircraft?
How much extra weight will be added and can mirage deal with the extra weight?
If mirages are turned into ew aircraft then what’s the reason why they weren’t being retired? Weren’t the main reasons the munitions it could carry and the range it had? Converting them into ew aircraft means it can’t be PAF’s bomb truck anymore.
Wouldn’t it just be more feasible to make ew version of JF-17B?
What’s the risk of putting such expensive ew equipment into such risky old airframes?

This news is most likely fake. It just doesn’t make sense to invest anything more into those old aircraft.
This guy is claiming that some mirages, whose airframes have some life left in them, are being turned into ew ac with easa radars n all...with chinese help......now if true then that be somthing but then again knowing how much PAF loves these mirages n the current chief is a mirage rider himself, i wouldn't be too suprised.

Don't mind the chaps accent 🙂

Just imagine there is a 1980's Honda and someone is trying to put a 1-ton Radar on it. :lol: Let's be honest, these Mirages which Pakistan Military is using are garbage aircrafts and are obsolete. In fact, these clowns just do not want to fund new jets because they are too busy with loot and plunder. And every now and then these looters just release such fairy tales news so that ordinary people can be lied to about how wonderful PAF is performing.

These jets do not BELONG IN 2023 AND BEYOND, THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN SCRAPPED DECADES AGO.


Post 1- its literally just ad revenue farm.

Post 2-
Technically, why not, there are some VERY small radars out there and they keep getting smaller, Infact, the first aircraft in the subcontinent to receive AESA radars were the IAF's Jaguars, which have TINY nosecones, these radars also designed for these applications have very compact back end systems too. Overall, they also dont weigh much. Raytheon's phantomstrike system weighs 45kg for the smaller version. Thales also launched the Airmaster C which weighs 25kg for the entire system with an antenna size of 40ish cm, while also only needing 1kW of power. Yes, they will need to be re wired and yes their only role is to be a bomber/strike aircraft.

JF-17 EW variant is difficult because the issue with it is literally that it cannot carry enough fuel, so its loiter time would be pretty poor thus not suited well for the mission. the PAF seems to prefer larger Standoff jammers anyway fitted on bizjets.

Post-4
Can you name one other jet in the PAF fleet that is capable of deploying Ra'ad? Or one other jet with the low-level strike performance of the Mirage? No, you can't. The mirage is a specialist, with a specialist role, it is the B52 of the PAF and cant be replaced by just anything, its the very reason why the PAF's NGFA is made to be strike oriented.0
 
Insulted Other Member/Nationality
I want PAF to make Mirage-5000 (stealth version of Mirage with sensor fusion, Pl-15, etc)
Because you are an idiot

Just imagine there is a 1980's Honda and someone is trying to put a 1-ton Radar on it. :lol: Let's be honest, these Mirages which Pakistan Military is using are garbage aircrafts and are obsolete. In fact, these clowns just do not want to fund new jets because they are too busy with loot and plunder. And every now and then these looters just release such fairy tales news so that ordinary people can be lied to about how wonderful PAF is performing.

These jets do not BELONG IN 2023 AND BEYOND, THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN SCRAPPED DECADES AGO.
Bull $hit. As long as the Indians are flying the Jags, Mirages are viable. You can take your Youthia/Randian narrative and push it up your a$$.
 
Hypothetically speaking, and not accounting for the technical details such as size of radar, power outputs required for the EW equipment, airframe life, airframe space etc., converting the Mirage to a dedicated EW platform like the EA-18 would not be that bad of a move would it?

Currently there are 2 DA-20 aircraft? I vaguely remember reading a news article that they were just updated? Is there a need in the PAF to get more EW capability in the air, in a strike role?

@SQ8 , @Raider 21
 
Post 1- its literally just ad revenue farm.

Post 2-
Technically, why not, there are some VERY small radars out there and they keep getting smaller, Infact, the first aircraft in the subcontinent to receive AESA radars were the IAF's Jaguars, which have TINY nosecones, these radars also designed for these applications have very compact back end systems too. Overall, they also dont weigh much. Raytheon's phantomstrike system weighs 45kg for the smaller version. Thales also launched the Airmaster C which weighs 25kg for the entire system with an antenna size of 40ish cm, while also only needing 1kW of power. Yes, they will need to be re wired and yes their only role is to be a bomber/strike aircraft.

JF-17 EW variant is difficult because the issue with it is literally that it cannot carry enough fuel, so its loiter time would be pretty poor thus not suited well for the mission. the PAF seems to prefer larger Standoff jammers anyway fitted on bizjets.

Post-4
Can you name one other jet in the PAF fleet that is capable of deploying Ra'ad? Or one other jet with the low-level strike performance of the Mirage? No, you can't. The mirage is a specialist, with a specialist role, it is the B52 of the PAF and cant be replaced by just anything, its the very reason why the PAF's NGFA is made to be strike oriented.0
Why is the PAF not buying a squadron of J-10CY to create dedicated EW platforms. If it’s a budgetary issue, then buy 2-3 a year and you’ll have a full squadron in 6-9 years.

If the mirages are a stop-gap, I would understand, but then why not get the pods for the J-10 and spread them out over two JF-17s.
 
Why is the PAF not buying a squadron of J-10CY to create dedicated EW platforms. If it’s a budgetary issue, then buy 2-3 a year and you’ll have a full squadron in 6-9 years.
It would depend on what the maintenance and conversion of the Mirages until the end of their life cost. If it is much less than buying new jets, then it makes sense to do so. Also on what the payment breakdown is like (no idea how it works in our case with China for example).

If the mirages are a stop-gap, I would understand, but then why not get the pods for the J-10 and spread them out over two JF-17s.

Having a dedicated platform like the EA-18 would require more upgrades rather than just modular pods, no? Assuming that is the kind of capability PAF wants.
 
This guy is claiming that some mirages, whose airframes have some life left in them, are being turned into ew ac with easa radars n all...with chinese help......now if true then that be somthing but then again knowing how much PAF loves these mirages n the current chief is a mirage rider himself, i wouldn't be too suprised.

Don't mind the chaps accent 🙂

Oh God no !
Please awaam per reham kahein

Don't spend billions on dead platform
 
It would depend on what the maintenance and conversion of the Mirages until the end of their life cost. If it is much less than buying new jets, then it makes sense to do so. Also on what the payment breakdown is like (no idea how it works in our case with China for example).



Having a dedicated platform like the EA-18 would require more upgrades rather than just modular pods, no? Assuming that is the kind of capability PAF wants.
True, a lot more then just pods, if the PAF wants to make a dedicated EW platform out of the mirage aircraft, it could fit an ECM system on top of the tail, as on the EA-6B or EF-111, then it could build two GAN pods, one high band and one low band to be carried on the closest hard points under the wings, and finally upgrade the radar to a modern GaN based radar to do EW work in the mid band.

This leaves room for two PL-10E for self protection at the outer wing hard points and room enough for two PL-15 based HARM missiles on the centerline, or similar system.

Couple this with avionics and networking upgrades and you have a dedicated EW platform. When the airframe gives out, swap these components onto a JF-17 and continue the mission.

Think of the Mirages like a drone wingman platform and think of a wingman platform with a 42 kn dry and 60 kn wet engine thrust drone can do it, why not a mirage.

Honestly, I wish they would have gone with an EW version of the JF-17B. It already has modern avionics and space for a large ECM set up on the tail.

Btw, according to some data on the Grifo M5 I found its array is 34 cm (in diameter?; can someone confirm) we should compare this to the diameter of the future EA-18G mid band jammer and work on modifications that allow similar electrical power generation capabilities.

Pakistan can work with China to develop scaled down version of sensors and jammers from their J-16D program.

Also, if they are going to put in this much work into these jet, they might as well try to get the guys from South Africa’s Denzel/Atlas company (if they are still around) that worked on the cheetah upgrades and put in the RD-93/WS-13 (based on a cheetah 847, that flew with a version of the rd-33) into these birds; to improve the thrust (considering the heavy EW and A2G munitions they will need to carry) and the need for more electrical power.


Perhaps the PAF can buy an Atlas Cheetah from the Ecuadorians, and save some development time, or see if the South Africans are willing to part with Cheetah 847?
 
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