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Yasmin Alibhai Brown: Jack Straw is right to ask hard questions about Asian men

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Yasmin Alibhai Brown: Jack Straw is right to ask hard questions about Asian men
Fear of racism should no longer be the veil covering up hard truths


The unrepentant British Pakistani gang leaders who violated young girls in Derby have been rightly reviled and given indefinite sentences. Their victims were almost all white. There it might have ended but for Jack Straw, who rekindled passions on all sides when he said that such Pakistani men thought these females were easy meat who deserved no respect or consideration ( I paraphrase). No solid evidence is provided by Straw to back these assertions. In fact, when he was Home Secretary he could have funded research on the matter, but failed to.

Still, even a man used to controversies must be nonplussed by the reaction to his comments. His words were thrown on to blazing pyres by fulminating leftie liberals, feminists, Muslims, Pakistanis, anti-racists and influential individuals who think of themselves as gravely responsible. It was unacceptable, they said, to racialise or ethnicise a particular crime; some even declared that any discussion of cultural factors was dangerous and racist.

Being avowedly a leftie liberal, anti-racist, feminist, Muslim, part-Pakistani, and yes, a very responsible person, I should be in the circle with these objectors – particularly as I can't stand the Rt Hon MP for Blackburn, his devious, shady politicking and moral expediency. However, just as when he criticised the full veil, I cannot condemn his views. How can I? Just before Christmas, I too wrote about these rapists and the anti-white cultural prejudices in some of their communities and families. It was a hard column to write, as is this one. Easier to pick your way barefoot through a dark park littered with broken glass. You need to think about every line, its effect, and know that you will step on the shard that will cut you, however carefully you tread.


I accept that on the basis of the evidence presented in court, this Derby gang was no different from that of the white grooming posse convicted in Cornwall in November. They too preyed on helpless, easily-pleased young white girls who were then used and destroyed. Most pedophiles in this country are white, and their victims too. Just because they harm their own doesn't make it less abominable or more acceptable. What does it matter to a young, white, rape victim whether her violator has pasty or dark skin? And it is gratifying that reputable figures like Barnado's Martin Narey and the judge in the Derby case have spoken out against wholesale racial scapegoating. We know extremists use race and crime statistics to stoke racial hatred against Britons of colour and from religious minorities. I have sometimes been a pin-up girl for the repellent BNP and English Defence League, whenever I criticise Muslims, or Asian values or black Britons who do wrong. You feel degraded and treacherous when this happens.

But I still say we need to expose and discuss more openly the underpinning values of the Asian criminal rings in many of our cities. If we don't, the evil will grow. Fear of racism should no longer be the veil covering up hard truths. What the Derby gang did has planted and raised more racism – possibly even among good, benign people – than my words ever could. I am sure recruitment to extremist parties has gone up too. Prominent anti-racists know that, but will not openly say so.

The criminals feel they did no wrong. These girls to them are trash, asking to be wasted – unlike their own women, who must be kept from the disorderly world out there. The whore and the virgin are both feared and severely controlled and abused. A 2005 study in the Netherlands of Muslim males found the same bifurcation, and identified deep sexism as responsible for both.

The conversations can be heard every day around dining tables and on streets; they are embedded in thought and language. I once interviewed the mother of a man who had been convicted of repeatedly raping his young wife, who came from a rural village in Pakistan. The head of the nursery school the couple's child attended had helped the victim report what was happening. In Urdu, the mother hissed: "How lucky was she to get my son? The dirty, ungrateful ***** – went to a white woman to complain. They sleep with everybody. She just didn't know how to make him happy. We have thrown her out. She can go on the streets like those whites now."

I have been writing about these culturally- sanctioned injustices for two decades, and have interviewed countless people. I will not melt the misdemeanours into generalities, and do not accept that ethnicity and sexual abuse cannot and should not ever be linked.

Some years back, a similar furore was raised over the Sierra Leonean journalist Sorious Samura, who made a TV documentary on the gang rape of young girls in British cities. Censured by the usual slate of apologists, he accepted that the attacks were carried out by men of all backgrounds, but pointed out that a high proportion were black or mixed-race. "As a black man as well as a journalist, I wanted to know what lay behind such attacks, the profoundly disturbing attitudes to females."

That is what I am seeking to do too, as a Muslim journalist who cares deeply about migrants and their progress. Let's ask questions we never ask, to find out more than we ever try to. Do these men have any idea of normal, pleasurable, healthy sex between a man and a woman? Are they maddened by their own frustration and fear of females? I am not impugning those Asian or Pakistani men who love women, but those who are too messed up to understand what that means; maybe those whose key choices, including their lifelong partners, have all been made by families operating as firms. And again, is this the most appalling pay-back for white racism? Black writers in the US, including Eldridge Cleaver, have written movingly about some of the unconscious, vengeful urges that impel black men to take up with white partners to assert power, sometimes to annihilate the person who trusts them.

Shouting down Jack Straw, busying ourselves with warnings about feeding the BNP, are displacement activities that will do nothing to stop Asian groomers, who, from childhood have developed distorted ideas about themselves, society, females, vice and virtue. Like Samura said, it is up to insiders to examine and reveal what lies beneath these crimes. We owe that to ourselves, to our future generations, and to the country we have made ours.

Yasmin Alibhai Brown: Jack Straw is right to ask hard questions about Asian men
 
Look, the problem is that these so called 'Pakistani's' who migrated to Britain decades ago were from deprived and attrociously backward villages in Punjab. Namely Mirpur and a few others, cant remember them correctly, where a number of families took their unimagineably backward thinking with them to a western nation and a lack of assimilation into their chosen country left them devoid of any moral development or mutual integration.

I have seen it myself, bunch of no-good Asians in Britian, all look, talk and walk the same, preying on all kinds of girls where ever they can.

We cannot blame the girls because a man has to be instilled with the decency not to take advantage of others. Though the fault lies in the upbringing aswell, many of these men do not have any sense to justify what they do is wrong.

This whole culture of degrading women based on their attire is very rampant through out the Muslim world. The hypocrisy is known to all and the depths that these people fall to is also very visible.

But the problem that I have is that you cannot classify a whole community because of the actions of a few. We can stereotype many others this way, but somehow this has been given more of a sensational spin than others.

They are British subjects living in England who take advantage of socially disadvantaged women, this is common for some in UK becuase with a lack of moral beliefs and the availability to meet desires allows such incidents to occur.

The jist of the issue lies in the fact that these so called 'Pakistani's failed to integrate and modernise while the government failed to change their mindset.
 
so jahil indians there havent raped the white girls, i cant understand as the indians in india are already raping the white girls freely..

Individual cases might be there,but there are no rings for grooming,Pakistanis in Britain are giving a bad name to Pakistan.
Although they are not born in Pakistan , yet they are associated with Pakistand and lead to more negativity.
I mean why do Pakistanis have to offend the brits.

Last year few were protesting the glory march for a British soldier.Why?
Why should they be concerned.I mean
Yaar theka mat le liya karo har jagah..They must assimilate in the culture where they are born
 
Look, the problem is that these so called 'Pakistani's' who migrated to Britain decades ago were from deprived and attrociously backward villages in Punjab. Namely Mirpur and a few others, cant remember them correctly, where a number of families took their unimagineably backward thinking with them to a western nation and a lack of assimilation into their chosen country left them devoid of any moral development or mutual integration.

I have seen it myself, bunch of no-good Asians in Britian, all look, talk and walk the same, preying on all kinds of girls where ever they can.

We cannot blame the girls because a man has to be instilled with the decency not to take advantage of others. Though the fault lies in the upbringing as well, many of these men do not have any sense to justify what they do is wrong.

This whole culture of degrading women based on their attire is very rampant through out the Muslim world. The hypocrisy is known to all and the depths that these people fall to is also very visible.

But the problem that I have is that you cannot classify a whole community because of the actions of a few. We can stereotype many others this way, but somehow this has been given more of a sensational spin than others.

They are British subjects living in England who take advantage of socially disadvantaged women, this is common for some in UK becuase with a lack of moral beliefs and the availability to meet desires allows such incidents to occur.

The jist of the issue lies in the fact that these so called 'Pakistani's failed to integrate and modernise while the government failed to change their mindset.
One way to look @ it is, stereotyping arises from the behavior of the majority members of the community and the conduct of its majority members vis-a-vis the conduct of the majority members of the other community. Pakistanis abysmally fail in both of these counts which is why the labeling is done with a broad-brush.

On the education front, work-force front as well as on tolerance, a lot many Pakistani males are @ the lower rung of the ladder. So yes, it takes time and fortitude to build a positive image in the society.

Indians who themselves are said to be among the well-educated and cream of the crop there, are degraded when stray incidents of wife-beating(Yes, the Indian diplomat incident) come to the fore. Hence, in no way i am condoning our moral turpitude too.
 
And that indian dude, who allegedly had his wife murdered in south africa, we must not stereotype communities, and the vast majority of peado's are white, don't get me wrong, anyone who gets up to this is scum, and should be treated as such.
 
One way to look @ it is, stereotyping arises from the behavior of the majority members of the community and the conduct of its majority members vis-a-vis the conduct of the majority members of the other community. Pakistanis abysmally fail in both of these counts which is why the labeling is done with a broad-brush.

Have you read the statitics associated with this particular scenario, where girls are being picked up men in cars. Out of 54 cases where abuse actually occured in this scenario, about 40 cases involved Asian men, from that a high number of Pakistani origin men were charged.

Tens of people are not a reflection of majority members, neither the conduct that can be attributed to Pakistani origin men that number in hundreds of thousand in that particular country alone.

There are many Pakistani who have achieved a lot and are very positive contributors to the state of England. This can be verified by the amount of Pakistani origin people who are found in the house of commons and house of lords, highest out of all other groups.

On the education front, work-force front as well as on tolerance, a lot many Pakistani males are @ the lower rung of the ladder. So yes, it takes time and fortitude to build a positive image in the society.

Nonsense, many Pakistani's are in well to do careers, expecially those who have migrated in recent years. The highest amount of work force found the lower rung of the ladder are Indians or Indian origin people. Even the ones who have good education from India are stuck in low paying jobs and this has been covered by many of your own newspapers.

Indians who themselves are said to be among the well-educated and cream of the crop there, are degraded when stray incidents of wife-beating(Yes, the Indian diplomat incident) come to the fore. Hence, in no way i am condoning our moral turpitude too.

Uk is the only country where the Indian diaspora have an edge over the Pakistani ones due to the fact that a majority of Pakistani's found in the UK are from the afore mentioned villages and they have limited reach becuase of cultural inhibitions.

Consider the other Pakistani communities though and you will be impressed with their success. Like AliBhai Brown, who is an Agha Khani, other Pakistani communities like the Ahmadi's and Christians in the UK are very well to do.

There is lack of knowledge on your part and spite that made you write that biased post, try to be a bit more clear and factual, if you may.

Btw, having countless men who work as delivery boy or cleaners does is not 'cream of the crop', actually far from it.
 
Nonsense, many Pakistani's are in well to do careers, expecially those who have migrated in recent years. The highest amount of work force found the lower rung of the ladder are Indians or Indian origin people. Even the ones who have good education from India are stuck in low paying jobs and this has been covered by many of your own newspapers.

There is lack of knowledge on your part and spite that made you write that biased post, try to be a bit more clear and factual, if you may.

Btw, having countless men who work as delivery boy or cleaners does is not 'cream of the crop', actually far from it.

Please take a good look at this list of the riches 100 in the UK. Let me know if you spot any Pakistani origin individuals.
I believe there are at least 5-6 Indians here, including some Indian passport holders. Check who is No.1 on this list too.

Find out about the Top 100 Richest people in the UK

My point is that you will find Indians across the spectrum. This seems to not be true among Pakistanis and Bangladeshis in the UK at least.
 
Please take a good look at this list of the riches 100 in the UK. Let me know if you spot any Pakistani origin individuals.
I believe there are at least 5-6 Indians here, including some Indian passport holders. Check who is No.1 on this list too.

Find out about the Top 100 Richest people in the UK

My point is that you will find Indians across the spectrum. This seems to not be true among Pakistanis and Bangladeshis in the UK at least.

Just like your fellow countrymen, you seem unaware of factual realities too.

Let me give examples of all spectrums that the Pakistani diaspora has covered in the UK.

Politics: Baroness Warsi, Tariq Ahmed, Sadiq Khan etc.

6 Pakistani origin people have won elections and some are even chairpersons of the major parties in Britain.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/current-events-social-issues/81306-three-asians-including-two-pakistani-heritage-appointed-upper-house-lords.html

Sports: Amir Khan, Sajjad Mehmood, Kabir Ali etc

Business: James Caan (very popular Pakistani born businessman who was one of the judges on Dragons Den), Sir Anwar Parvez (6th richest Asian in Great Britain), Shaf Rasul (one of the richest in Scotland) etc

Entertainment: Art Malik (Dual British-Pakistani, very popular from the 80's), Mishal Husain (BBC), Natasha Khan (singer) etc

There are many, just go through them from here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:English_people_of_Pakistani_descent

Similarly, Pakistani's out-staged Indian businessmen in the 80's with the likes of Mahmud Sipra and Agha Hassan Abedi amongst many others.

Even Pakistan’s millionaires were more glamorous than ours. In the Eighties when the Hinduja brothers (“we are strictly vegetarian”) first emerged in London, the Pakistanis stole the show with such flamboyant high-profile millionaires in Mahmud Sipra who financed feature films and kept a big yacht in the South of France.

Unfortunately, the deeds of Pakistani's has made sure that we are not allowed to interfere too much into the western world.

What devoured glamorous Pakistan? | | | Indian Express

Things have gone wrong as the wrong people are in charge of our nation, but trust me, the same old people who commanded respect worldwide are still around and will turn this nation around.

In due time though.

Btw, Agha Khan is on the list, Ahga Khans father was a Pakistani diplomat, Prince Aly Khan who was famously married to Rita Hayworth.

Similarly, his grandfather, Agha Khan III was the first president of the Muslim League and an important personality for Pakistan.

We have many super rich too but they either do not disclose their wealth or remain quiet.

Look up Mian Mohammed Mansha Yaha, Hashwani's, Schon, Saigols, Shahnawaz, Tata, Riaz Malik, Lakhani, Razzaq Yakoubs, Habibs, Seth Abid, Avari, Cowasjee etc.

Then count the landlords, count the politicians, or better yet walk down miles of DHA in each city and you will get an idea of the wealth that flows in our nation.
 
Look, the problem is that these so called 'Pakistani's' who migrated to Britain decades ago were from deprived and attrociously backward villages in Punjab. Namely Mirpur and a few others, cant remember them correctly, where a number of families took their unimagineably backward thinking with them to a western nation and a lack of assimilation into their chosen country left them devoid of any moral development or mutual integration.

Mirpuris don't consider themselves Punjabi. They seperate themselves from Punjabi.
 
@T-Faz
My post did not touch upon achievements of any nation, just the wealth creation of Indians in the UK. Why? Because thats what you concentrated on, in your post.

Of course Pakistanis have a great many achievements in the UK in non-business areas, no argument there.

About Aga Khan, the Pakistani link is very, very tenuous. His father was born in Italy out of an Italian mother and never lived in Pakistan. The late Aly Khan's only connection is the 2 years that he was Pakistan's rep to the UN. Really a stretch to make any Pakistani connection with the present Aga Khan.t
PS: Isn't 'TATA' an Indian company? Why is it in your list of Pakistani wealthy people?
 
Just like your fellow countrymen, you seem unaware of factual realities too.

Let me give examples of all spectrums that the Pakistani diaspora has covered in the UK.

Politics: Baroness Warsi, Tariq Ahmed, Sadiq Khan etc.

6 Pakistani origin people have won elections and some are even chairpersons of the major parties in Britain.

Unfortunately the good people never count. Its always about the crooks. Mind you a considerable amount of local Brits probably don't want Pakistanis or Indians for that matter in their country. So our job as migrants is to obey the law and not give them some skewed statistics using which they can malign the whole community (including the good ones).

For whatever reasons Pakistanis just have a bad reputation when it comes to crimes, even here in Australia, where the Pakistani migrant population is considerably less. There was this government release about the country of origin of all the inmates in Australian prisons. The number of Pakistan born inmates was baffling, given how small the Pakistani diaspora in Australia is.

You know it just gives the racists and red neck something to talk about. They know about the Indian-Pakistani rivalry and then they start comparing, as why Pakistanis commit more crime than Indians and all that blah blah.

I guess what am trying to say is that, its not about Indians being more successful than Pakistanis. Its about more Pakistani crooks than say Indian ones. I hope i didn't offend anyone. :cheers:
 
as why Pakistanis commit more crime than Indians and all that blah blah.

You do know that the BCS survey that concluded this rather nonsensical assessment was later criticized in the House of Lords, yes?
 
@T-Faz
My post did not touch upon achievements of any nation, just the wealth creation of Indians in the UK. Why? Because thats what you concentrated on, in your post.

I never touched upon wealth generation but rather the involvement of the Pakistani diaspora in a multitude of sectors within the UK, the OP has a mission, to demean Pakistan and Pakistani's by overlooking the facts.

I was referring to the contribution of the community in terms of assimilation into all fields that are available, far from the 'lower rung of the ladder' the other fella was talking about.

Of course Pakistanis have a great many achievements in the UK in non-business areas, no argument there.

Like I said, the most famous businessman from a minority in the UK is currently James Caan, he was born in Pakistan.

About Aga Khan, the Pakistani link is very, very tenuous. His father was born in Italy out of an Italian mother and never lived in Pakistan. The late Aly Khan's only connection is the 2 years that he was Pakistan's rep to the UN. Really a stretch to make any Pakistani connection with the present Aga Khan.t
PS: Isn't 'TATA' an Indian company? Why is it in your list of Pakistani wealthy people?

The current Agha Khan, just like his father retains dual nationality. The Aga Khans primarily have their base in Pakistan, specifically Karachi.

Prince Aly Khan could only be appointed as a representative if he had Pakistani citizenship and he did. The Aga Khans have extensive interests in Pakistan and if you have lived in Karachi, you would know how the minority communities are the most literate and well off.

In similar fashion, the Hindujas, operated out of Tehran, moving to London after the Islmaic revolution, their only relation to India is their business interests and heritage.

So you can herdly call them Indians.

Pakistan has their own Tata family, they are not Parsi's though.
 
Unfortunately the good people never count. Its always about the crooks. Mind you a considerable amount of local Brits probably don't want Pakistanis or Indians for that matter in their country. So our job as migrants is to obey the law and not give them some skewed statistics using which they can malign the whole community (including the good ones).

But many do, the point is not to marginalise whole communities when a handful have commited a certain crime. When the majority is law abiding and hard working, then there should not be public statements made that target the whole community.

Jack Straws own brother was convicted of abusing a teenage girl, going by his logic, all Straws must be hugry for some teenage 'white meat'.

For whatever reasons Pakistanis just have a bad reputation when it comes to crimes, even here in Australia, where the Pakistani migrant population is considerably less. There was this government release about the country of origin of all the inmates in Australian prisons. The number of Pakistan born inmates was baffling, given how small the Pakistani diaspora in Australia is.

Can you provide me with a link please.

You know it just gives the racists and red neck something to talk about. They know about the Indian-Pakistani rivalry and then they start comparing, as why Pakistanis commit more crime than Indians and all that blah blah.

Most rednecks cannot even find Pakistan on a map, let alone discuss things rationally.

Many think Pakistan is in the Middle East.

I guess what am trying to say is that, its not about Indians being more successful than Pakistanis. Its about more Pakistani crooks than say Indian ones. I hope i didn't offend anyone. :cheers:

Again, its not factually correct to say that there are more 'Pakistani' crooks than Indians, no one has counted them and neither can you provide any proof of it.
 

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