Why Pakistan is wealthier than India

[prashantazazel]

But UP is a land locked state.

UP gains from proximity to the national capital.
It would have been really well developed if not for the insane population.

 

[Cobra Arbok]

Its only HDI which could be used to gauge the development of state or country???

What about GDP nominal ,GDP PPP and GDP per ca pita etc ???

UP's GDP is 770 compared to about 1400 for Pak. however, UP is one of the poorest states in India.

 

[War Thunder]

mery pass to 22000$ se ziada ki wealth hai bhai ye kya baat hoi 22000$ ka to ajkal 5 marly ka plot milta hai wo bhi city se bahir .

to uss wealth ko kahi invest karein aur kuch faida dein mulk aur awam ko.

 

[Imran Khan]

to uss wealth ko kahi invest karein aur kuch faida dein mulk aur awam ko.

ker rakha hai sir

 

[War Thunder]

india has more population, hence there can't be an easy distribution of wealth there as is in Pakistan. Hence, the avg man is more wealthier and Pakistan as a whole enjoys better infrastructure and access to services than most indians would.
An avg Pakistani has a better livelihood than an indian and that's the truth, but not because Pakistan as a whole is making more money than india.

The other problem is wealth acquisition and spending practices of Pakistanis and indians are quite different. Like I come across many south indians and their way of living is quite messed up tbh. It's like they'll take another 50 years to become civilized if they ever did.

ker rakha hai sir

achi baat hai.
I'm an internet marketer and excel in ways of making money from home.
Thinking of opening up a small institute for free education of the youth there in Pak, and some practical experience without them having to pay anything, and then can even hire some of them to work with me as a team.

 

[War Thunder]

What south indian custom is barbaric to ypu ?

not barbaric mate, and i didn;t mean to offend anyone. I have studied the history of south indians and in particular the tamil and I find it quite interesting.

My problem is with the people who represent the south india. No one finds it easy to live around them or close to them, not even north indians, let alone Pakistanis or other nations.

And it's their way of doing things. I mean just to take very small example.
Wherever there is a bunch of them, they speak like they got loud speakers in front of their mouth.
And when they are not doing that, they are playing some loud *** music and disturbing people around.
And that's just the simplest of things...


P.S: I have same issues with Punjabis from Pakistan, specially lahoris. They speak too much and too loud.

 

[Cobra Arbok]

india has more population, hence there can't be an easy distribution of wealth there as is in Pakistan. Hence, the avg man is more wealthier and Pakistan as a whole enjoys better infrastructure and access to services than most indians would.
An avg Pakistani has a better livelihood than an indian and that's the truth, but not because Pakistan as a whole is making more money than india.

The other problem is wealth acquisition and spending practices of Pakistanis and indians are quite different. Like I come across many south indians and their way of living is quite messed up tbh. It's like they'll take another 50 years to become civilized if they ever did.




achi baat hai.
I'm an internet marketer and excel in ways of making money from home.
Thinking of opening up a small institute for free education of the youth there in Pak, and some practical experience without them having to pay anything, and then can even hire some of them to work with me as a team.

i agree that indians and pakistanis may be different in their spendin habits amongbother things, but your conclusion contradicts research by the un and WB. Even if you ignore gdp per capita, which has flaws, the hdi and mpi index are still the most accurate measures of development, and india ranks 20 spots ahead of pakistan on both of them. India also ranks ahead of pakistan on hdi adjusted for inequality. But tbh, India isnt that much better than pakistan. Using development statistics as a d*** measuring contest is not helpful.

UP gains from proximity to the national capital.
It would have been really well developed if not for the insane population.

UP is a remnant of the mughals and british and needs to be broken up. It is too big to govern properly.

 

[Indx-techs]

but as per few illiterate indians (majority) indians are light years ahead of Pakistan

AFAIK you got higher illiteracy than India's.
As far as wealth is concerned, Iranians or Omanis being wealthier than Chinese doesn't give them any technological advantage.
India has far more diversified economy than all its neighbours except China.
No offence intended though.

ASSET CLASSES
An ambitious project to measure the wealth of nations shows how GDP is a deceptive gauge of progress
By Eshe Nelson & Dan Kopf

January 31, 2018

Is gross domestic product a sufficient measure of an economy’s health? Many argue that GDP, which counts the sum of the goods and services produced by a nation, fails to reflect a population’s wellbeing, because it accounts for neither distribution of income nor extractive effects such as pollution.

This week, the World Bank published an ambitious project to measure economies by wealth, to get a more complete picture of a nation’s health, both in the present and the future. The Changing Wealth of Nations analyzes the wealth of 141 countries, from 1995 to 2014. The report argues that wealth is a better judge of economic success because it measures the flow of income that a country’s assets generate over time—although it is significantly more challenging to measure. “A country’s level of economic development is strongly related to the composition of its national wealth,” the report states.

Wealth includes all assets, which means human capital (the value of earnings over a person’s lifetime), natural capital (energy, minerals, agricultural land), produced capital (machinery, buildings, urban land), and net foreign assets.

Assessing an economy by GDP instead of wealth is like looking exclusively at a company’s income statements without considering the assets on its balance sheet. A company can make its income look good for a short time by liquidating assets, but over the long run this will reduce the firm’s productive capacity and other means of generating income in the future.

The same applies to a country. GDP “does not reflect depreciation and depletion of assets, whether investment and accumulation of wealth are keeping pace with population growth, or whether the mix of assets is consistent with a country’s development goals,” the report states. That said, for most countries GDP is strongly correlated to wealth.

However, there are outliers. For example, in Turkey, GDP outpaces wealth. Kuwait has much more wealth per capita than its GDP (as does Saudi Arabia, but to a lesser extent). Kuwait and Saudi Arabia have the resources to make investments far into future. Saudi Arabia is making these efforts, diversifying its economy away from oil under a plan known as Vision 2030.

The push for wealth accounting also came up in the 1980s, the World Bank says. Back then, there were concerns that the rapid growth in GDP of resource-rich countries was mostly the result of liquidating natural capital—wealth accounts would have been a better measurement of an economy’s health at the time.

In many rich countries, human capital tends to be the largest component of wealth, whereas natural capital is higher in low- and middle-income economies. Global wealth increased 66%, to $1,143 trillion, between 1995 to 2014. And while total wealth increased almost everywhere, per capita wealth did not. Some low-income economies experienced a decline because population growth outpaced investment, especially in parts of Africa. The share of global wealth held by low-income countries remained at about 1% throughout the period of study, even as their share of the world population increased from 6% to 8%.

The table below shows the share of wealth that comes from different types of capital for the 10 most populous countries in the world. Human capital accounts for roughly two-thirds of global wealth.

As global economies develop, the composition of wealth changes. In low- and middle-income countries, human capital wealth on a per-capita basis tends to increase, while aging populations and stagnant wage growth means that this component shrinks for richer countries. Still, in high-income countries human capital comprises some 70% of wealth, and natural capital only 3%.

Simply having natural capital is not enough to ensure the economic development of lower-income countries, the World Bank says. Of the 24 countries classified low-income since 1995, 12 are resource rich, the organization says.

Globally, another way to increase wealth is through gender equality. The World Bank finds that women account for less than 40% of human capital wealth because of their lower earnings, lower labor force participation, and fewer average hours of work. If the gender pay gap were closed, the world would experience a 18% increase in human capital wealth.

----- EDIT ------ (VIDEO ADDED)

Well, GDP accounts for your "income" about how much liquidity is circulated within economy & Wealth is about assets.

Its pretty obvious that an average Pakistani will remain wealthier than an average Indian for one more decade at least:

1. Pakistan's GDP per capita was higher than India's for around 60 years.
2. Pakistan got its poorest part (east Bengal) cut off in 1971 while India's poor states remain with its affecting national average. Nevertheless, those states are growing at enormous rates now. Bangladesh itself has caught up to great extent.
3. Cost factor, same volume of material will cost lower in India in Market Exchange Rates. Another example is India's production volume is same as that of US & China. But the stuff India produces is of fourth industrial revolution which is cheaper & India's cheap labour further cuts down its costs.
4. We shouldn't compare when our indicators are close because a large part of our incomes are undocumented. India has only 15% of its companies registered. As India, Pakistan & Bangladesh sustain better human development indicators than Africa despite close income levels, their GDP (nominal) capita is no less than $3,000-4,000 if completely documented. Pakistan & Bangladesh are at least $500-600 billions economies & India is at least $5 trillions if shadow economy gets recorded.

Pakistan grew much faster than India since 60s, India gained pace only after 90s, caught up in human development indicators very recently and will take another decade to create considerable gap between wealth & that only if India continues its pace.

if you want to see real wealth just see the consumption pattern of these 3 countries Pakistan, Indian & Bangladesh and you will get shocking results.

You yourself may get shocked as consumptions greatly fluctuate for varying commodities & time periods.

Pakistanis consume more in gas, steel & concrete etc. commodities while Indians are more with electronics, internet, wine, automotives & gaming stuff etc..
Bangladesh has other commodities.

And their availability vary due to reasons that Pakistan's financial well being isn't enough. You will find communication cheaper in India due to its space infrastructure.
Its easier & cheaper to buy manufactured goods in Bangladesh because of industrialization due to foreign investments and India due to foreign investment + local firms and massive R&Ds.
For same car, you pay 60% more in Pakistan.
For wine, more & more Indians have started to drink while Pakistan & Bangladesh being Muslim countries might not be drinking that often.
Another case, Indians remain one of most malnourished nationals in world despite holding relatively better economic conditions because a larg fraction is vegetarian.
Pakistanis usually have basic industries like fabric guaranteeing security because of its continuous demand while India has been trying to support heavy engineering & IT infrastructure for localized machinery.

Other fluctuations due to time like Pakistani steel & concrete consumption soared after CPEC started & India's soaring after starting its freight corridor & its 13th five years plan focused on infrastructure.

In R&D sector, primarily due to more investments, India's per capita IPRs are at par with developed countries.

Dude there are lot lot factors and in economic indicators, if two countries are close, they will be trumping each other in one after other indicator.

Pakistan was growing with 4 Asian tigers is structurally different, Chinese & other east asian economies boomed after 70s are different and Indian & SE Asian economies attained growth after 90s are having different structures.

Different structures of wealth distribution & sectors.

 

[GeraltofRivia]

It is even worse garbage than the Credit Suisse one (at least that one attempts to tabulate only liquid, physically owned assets). Hope enough people can smell that its off....especially for developing countries.

I am only concerned with that which can be brought to the surface credibly and projected for argument/discussion. I mean 90% of the internet is the "dark web"....I dont think most people really venture there....and for good reason. Thus quality of "hidden/unextracted" more immutable resources/wealth in such analysis is similarly flawed.

@GeraltofRivia @Joe Shearer @jhungary @Jungibaaz

I guess this kind of wealth report does offer an useful view to the economical state of nations, which as the report pointed out is an asset view. That being said, cautions need to applied when we interpret the numbers. I tend to look at them as a rough “guide” to the economical state, just like how one should read an accounting statement.

Also compared to the Credit Suisse report, which basically has three measurable elements: financial asset, real asset and debt, this WB report includes other things like human capital that are far more difficult to quantity and therefore some pretty large margin of error need to be factored in.

 

[PakSword]

I looked at it. First of all it is some website, not a direct UN report. And there is no way Pakistan has under three percent in poverty. The website actually shows India is reducing poverty at a fast rate, and is on track to reach global poverty reduction benchmarks. Different organizations have different methodologies, which is fine, but I prefer to use data directly from the UN, which is the most accurate. The latest HDI rankings show India 130, Pakistan 150. The MPI index 2018 shows the exact same numbers, India 130, Pakistan 150. Now granted that is by no means great or ideal, but it still disproves the claim that Pakistan is wealthier than India and that the average Pakistani is wealthier than the average Indian, when it is in fact the opposite, though not by much. Hence, the rationale behind this thread is incorrect.
http://hdr.undp.org/en/countries/profiles/IND
http://hdr.undp.org/en/countries/profiles/PAK

I hope you sleep well.

I don't usually respond to people who have some issues with learning behaviors.. But since you seem to be rational is some aspects, I am responding to you one last time..

First thing first, I have not suggested anywhere that I am proud of what Pakistan has right now... but for the sake of the website title, I will stick to what should be discussed rather than bringing other socio-economic indicators in the discussion.

1 - The website which I referred to in my post uses the data obtained from multiple sources. That's why I asked you to go through the website. However, as you want to hear the name of big organizations, let me give you the easiest to find information, from world bank.. According to world bank's world development indicators, percentage of population living under USD 1.9, 3.2 and 5.5 is provided below:

The above is self explanatory. Median wealth figures agree with the above data (although it's about earning potential). Income and wealth distributions should be taken into consideration, not just the average data. An example is that if in a community, there are 100 people and only 1 earns 99 usd, while the rest earn 1 usd together, the average income will be 1 usd.. In another community, if all earn 1 usd, the average will again come as 1 usd.. However, people in the second community will be much happier than in the second community, where income disparity is huge..

In the above as well, Income is more evenly distributed in Pakistan (as wealth indicators I quoted in my earlier posts). At under 1.9 usd, India has 10-12 percent population, while Pakistan has 3-4 percent. Under 3.2 usd, you have 35-40, we have 25 - 30.. While when you put the bar even higher, Pakistan has much higher population living under 5.5, while India has less population. This gives as indication that income is somewhat more evenly distributed in Pakistan, then in India.. If Pakistan takes out income from the pockets of people living under 1.9 and 3.2, and give it to people living under 5.5, we will also look like Indians..

Again, I am not saying that India is not on track of eradicating extreme poverty, what I am saying is that in Pakistan, extreme poverty has been tackled already and India will reach there in some more years..

2 - Now lets discuss the HDI which you are hell bent on using as an economic indicator. First of all, The Human Development Index (HDI) is a statistic composite index of life expectancy, education, and per capita income indicators, which are used to rank countries into four tiers of human development. It has nothing to do with wealth, and ironically, our topic is WEALTH. One more thing, in 2010 Human Development Report introduced an Inequality-adjusted Human Development Index(IHDI). While the simple HDI remains useful, it stated that "the IHDI is the actual level of human development (accounting for inequality)", and "the HDI can be viewed as an index of 'potential' human development (or the maximum IHDI that could be achieved if there were no inequality)".

Another irony is that a Pakistani economist developed the HDI.

Anyway, India is beating Pakistan in IHDI, where India stands at 101, and Pakistan at 118. See here as well, due to equality adjustments, Pakistan jumped more spots up then India.. However, are you really proud of being ranked at 101? Loll.. I wouldn't be proud of ranking at any number beyond 100.. even 50.. sorry..

3 - As I said earlier, this is my last post on this topic with you.. If you need more clarifications, please do not hesitate to do research on the relevant topics. Thanks..

I don't know. I am just a simpleton and take things at face value. So I will assume that

Pakistani government is poor but Pakistanis are rich

Indian government is rich but Indians are poor.

My question is assuming if what is being said is true can I infer that

Pakistanis are thieves when compared to Indians as they do not seem to be paying taxes to their government?

I didn't say that Pakistani are rich.. This terms is only reserved for Indians.. I said that Pakistanis are not so poor, however, government is..
And yes, a lot of Pakistanis do not pay taxes.. As per the current estimates, only 800,000 pay taxes.. There is no tax on agricultural income as well.. So a large population gets relaxation. Since our politicians are mostly agriculturalists, they make policies in their favor..

 

[Rajesh Kumar]

Lol! that's fine that we are struggling in many filed but do not compare us with Rape incident please .In that category ,you are doing pretty well .

and who are in top 6 even being 6 times smaller compare to India?

 

[Indx-techs]

At under 1.9 usd, India has 10-12 percent population

It is now 4.5%.
Look at report, India's data is for 2012 while Pakisan is for 2015.
As of November 2018,
India's extreme poverty ratio stood at 4.5% while Pakistan at 2.1%.

At current speed, achieving ahead of SDG target of achieving 0.1% extreme poverty, India (2026) will do before Pakistan (2029).

 

[PakSword]

It is now 4.5%.
Look at report, India's data is for 2012 while Pakisan is for 2015.
As of November 2018,
India's extreme poverty ratio stood at 4.5% while Pakistan at 2.1%.

At current speed, achieving ahead of SDG target of achieving 0.1% extreme poverty, India (2026) will do before Pakistan (2029).

Good for you guys. Tell this to your fellow countrymen that India has more extreme poverty than Pakistan.

Who knows about the future, maybe or current government policies and cpec may increase our growth rate

 

[Indx-techs]

Tell this to your fellow countrymen that India has more extreme poverty than Pakistan.

Interested ones know but common ones don't bother who's better.
Indians don't bother for same issues with Pakistanis like Pakistanis do, both have a different perspective.
Pakistan grew much faster than India in 60s, China since 1978 and India since 1991. So, every country has its highs & lows. No ego issues here.

Who knows about the future, maybe or current government policies and cpec may increase our growth rate

Only thing holding you guys back is your 2% population growth rate which is holding back your GDP per capita. Every other problem is short lived.
Pakistan has still done credible work in eliminating poverty and just like West became rich in first half & East Asia became rich in second half of 20th century, Indian subcontinent is improving since start 21st century. India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Nepal, Ceylon & Afghanistan, our time has started as east & west are getting older.

Regards

 

[PakSword]

Interested ones know but common ones don't bother who's better.
Indians don't bother for same issues with Pakistanis like Pakistanis do, both have a different perspective.
Pakistan grew much faster than India in 60s, China since 1978 and India since 1991. So, every country has its highs & lows. No ego issues here.

Only thing holding you guys back is your 2% population growth rate which is holding back your GDP per capita. Every other problem is short lived.
Pakistan has still done credible work in eliminating poverty and just like West became rich in first half & East Asia became rich in second half of 20th century, Indian subcontinent is improving since start 21st century. India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Nepal, Ceylon & Afghanistan, our time has started as east & west are getting older.

Regards

Agree.

I even said that I am not satisfied with what we have right now.. even if we have less extreme poverty, most of the people in Pakistan earn less than 5.5 dollars as per 2015 estimates..

But yes, times will change for Pakistan for better when Afghanistan will stabilize a little. Since 80s, Pakistan has been suffering from the influx of refugees together with drugs and ammunition.