The Mongol Destruction of Baghdad

[Al_Muhannad]

Wait till the Aryans of mother Persia find out that farsi is a Turkish language in the sense that turks financed it and more farsi literature was produced in turkish lands (e.g Hindustan). Same story for Urdu.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1594381967675400192

 

[Corruptistan]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1594381967675400192

Why have I never seen that? A whole stadium doing the Nazi Salute in Mullah-ruled Iran while the German national anthem is playing. Absolutely amazing.

The good old "PEEERSIAAAN ARYAAANS" "logic". It never gets old when we have a bunch of brown-skinned Middle Easterners thinking that they have some kind of absurd kinship with some kind of poster SS Nazis.

Sorry for the off-topic, but that video is "amazing" in a good comical way. Is there a longer video f this?

BTW, if you want to see more Iranian delusion, just watch this video below:

I thought that Persian/Iranian delusion was limited to keyboard warriors on the internet but it appears that genuinely normal/average Iranians have this disease too.

Explains some of my discussions with them on PDF, lol. Now everything makes sense.

 

[Genghis khan1]

The Mughals belonged to the Barlas tribe (paternally) which is a Mongol tribe. As I wrote, later the ancestors of Mughals began to intermarry with Turkic peoples/tribes in modern-day Central Asia.

This is why the founder (Babur) of the Mughal Empire's father was born in Uzbekistan (modern-day).

Umar Shaikh Mirza II - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

His father on the other hand was born in Herat.

Abu Sa'id Mirza - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And that person's grandfather (Miran Shah)

Miran Shah - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

was a son of Timur.

And Timur was of Mongol origin and belonged to the Mongol Barlas tribe, as I wrote.

The origin of the Timurid dynasty goes back to the Mongol tribe known as Barlas, who were remnants of the original Mongol army of Genghis Khan,[2][9][10] founder of the Mongol Empire.
​

Timurid dynasty - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

So if we go by paternal ancestry (which is what we do in our part of the world and most of the world -always been the case), they (Mughals) are Mongol in origin.

But as I wrote, there was very little (if anything) Mongol about the Mughals other than their distant ancestry.

Like I said, there is lot of miss information. There is a historical video on YouTube about China Han dynasty, Tatar, Mongols. Their diff types and persecution history .

Mughal are not mongols. Maldyal (local for Mughals) race in Kashmir is the living proof of it. Pick random men and women from Maldyal families and then random sample from Tatars living in Russian/Ukrainian states.

Compare their color, hight, weight, facial structure, then comparing them to Mongolian tribe.

Disclaimer: some Tatar tribe also intermix with other central Asian races i.e Mongols. But just like Mughal in Pakistan have brownish touch, Tatar living in different regions have some variation.

 

[Corruptistan]

Like I said, there is lot if miss information. There is a historical video on YouTube about China Han dynasty, Tatar, Mongols. Different Their types and persecution.

Mughal are not mentioned mongols. Maldyal (local for Mughals) race in Kashmir is the living proof of it. Pick random men and women from Maldyal families and then random sample from Tatars from living in Russian/Ukrainian states.

Compare their color, hight, weight, facial structure, then comparing them to Mongolian tribe.

Disclaimer: some Tatar tribe also intermix with other central Asian races i.e Mongols. But just like Mughal in Pakistan have brownish touch, Tatar living in different regions have some variation.

Bro, all I am saying is that it is fairly well-established and well-recognized (the Mughals themselves mentioned it in their writings too) that they (Mughals) were originally Mongol in origin. From the Mongol Barlas tribe. The same tribe that their ancestor (Timur) belonged to.

There is nothing more to add here. I am talking about the paternal ancestry of the Mughals. Of course they intermarried heavily with Turkic peoples (later post-Timur generations) and after they reached South Asia they began to mainly intermarry with local Biharis and Indians proper, which is why the later Mughal Emperors looked "North Indian". As do their modern-day descendents.

There is nothing wrong with being of Mongol origin.

Most people with a degree of Turkic ancestry in Pakistan are Central Asian in origin. From mostly modern-day Uzbekistan. The same route of migration which the Timurids took and the Mughals took.

 

[Genghis khan1]

Bro, all I am saying is that it is fairly well-established and well-recognized (the Mughals themselves mentioned it in their writings too) that they (Mughals) were originally Mongol in origin. From the Mongol Barlas tribe. The same tribe that their ancestor (Timur) belonged to.

There is nothing more to add here. I am talking about the paternal ancestry of the Mughals. Of course they intermarried heavily with Turkic peoples (later post-Timur generations) and after they reached South Asia they began to mainly intermarry with local Biharis and Indians proper, which is why the later Mughal Emperors looked "North Indian". As do their modern-day descendents.

There is nothing wrong with being of Mongol origin.

Most people with a degree of Turkic ancestry in Pakistan are Central Asian in origin. From mostly modern-day Uzbekistan. The same route of migration which the Timurids took and the Mughals took.

I am not saying, Mughal don’t have any link to Mongols. We all know Tamuir trace is maternal heritage to Genghis Khan. Barlas most probably does, their early deception even look similar to Uzbek Mongol people. but Barlas is just one tribe of many. Not all Mughal have similar characteristics.

 

[Al_Muhannad]

Why have I never seen that? A whole stadium doing the Nazi Salute in Mullah-ruled Iran while the German national anthem is playing. Absolutely amazing.

The good old "PEEERSIAAAN ARYAAANS" "logic". It never gets old when we have a bunch of brown-skinned Middle Easterners thinking that they have some kind of absurd kinship with some kind of poster SS Nazis.

View attachment 899110

View attachment 899111



Sorry for the off-topic, but that video is "amazing" in a good comical way. Is there a longer video f this?

BTW, if you want to see more Iranian delusion, just watch this video below:

I thought that Persian/Iranian delusion was limited to keyboard warriors on the internet but it appears that genuinely normal/average Iranians have this disease too.

Explains some of my discussions with them on PDF, lol. Now everything makes sense.

These are undercurrents under an apparently static ground. We, Pakistanis, must be prepared for things to come from both east and west.

 

[Corruptistan]

I am not saying, Mughal don’t have any link to Mongols. We all know Tamuir trace is maternal heritage to Genghis Khan. Barlas most probably does, their early deception even look similar to Uzbek Mongol people. but Barlas is just one tribe of many. Not all Mughal have similar characteristics.

Mughals traced their paternal ancestry to the Mongol Burlas tribe. As did Timur who they descended from. So the Mughals (as in the ruling Mughal family and creators of the Mughal Empire) were Mongol in terms of paternal ancestry.

As I already wrote, the post-Timurid era saw them intermarrying with local Turks in Uzbekistan and Afghanistan. Probably non-Turkic locals too. Later what occurred with them in terms of intermarrying and apearance, we all know, I posted it already.

Anyway, as I already wrote, there is nothing wrong with being of paternal Mongol origin, millions of people in East Asia, Central Asia etc. share this in common.

Just read up on the genetic legacy of Genghis Khan alone.

Family and descendants of Genghis Khan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

There is a good chance of most/or at least a large portion of people in Northern and Western South Asia, Central Asia, East Asia, Middle East, Anatolia and Eastern Europe/Russia having a degree of Mongol origin some way down their family tree.

 

[Genghis khan1]

Mughals traced their paternal ancestry to the Mongol Burlas tribe. As did Timur who they descended from. So the Mughals (as in the ruling Mughal family and creators of the Mughal Empire) were Mongol in terms of paternal ancestry.

As I already wrote, the post-Timurid era saw them intermarrying with local Turks in Uzbekistan and Afghanistan. Probably non-Turkic locals too. Later what occurred with them in terms of intermarrying and apearance, we all know, I posted it already.

Anyway, as I already wrote, there is nothing wrong with being of paternal Mongol origin, millions of people in East Asia, Central Asia etc. share this in common.

Just read up on the genetic legacy of Genghis Khan alone.

Family and descendants of Genghis Khan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

There is a good chance of most/or at least a large portion of people in Northern and Western South Asia, Central Asia, East Asia, Middle East, Anatolia and Eastern Europe/Russia having a degree of Mongol origin some way down their family tree.

Britannia encyclopedia is much more reliable source.

Tatar | people

Tatar, also spelled Tartar, any member of several Turkic-speaking peoples that collectively numbered more than 5 million in the late 20th century and lived mainly in west-central Russia along the central course of the Volga River and its tributary, the Kama, and thence east to the Ural...

www.britannica.com

Tatar = Turko mongol.

@04:00

 

[PakFactor]

Can we all just agree that the destruction of Baghdad was a terrible thing? The lives,the knowledge,the culture lost...

Yes and No, Bhai, it's sad life was lost, but they deserve it as a nation. It's essential to be at war and ready for battle. In our region, we've suffered from the ill's of relaxation when leaders neglect and go into palace building and tranny dancing. They baked their pie and ate it; hence, in Pakistan, we have a saying, "due to one's mistakes, seven generations suffer."

Baybars did not defeat one of the great Khans in the battlefield. They capitalized on a Mongolian crisis period to their advantage to recover some of the lands lost to Mongols.

Details in following post:

The Mongol Destruction of Baghdad

Saladin was a soldier in Turkish Army ( ZENGI Dynasty ) of the Great Seljuk Empire Turkish Atabeg Nureddin Zengi sent Turkish Army , Saladin and his uncle Shirkuh to Egypt to fight Crusaders that was Turkish Army led by Saladin even BAIBARS KHAN was Turkic origin Sultan of Egypt in the...

defence.pk

Mongolian leader and one of the great Khans, Berke Khan had converted to Islam and should be credited for saving the pan-Islamic world as correctly pointed out by @waz in this thread. This man prevented Halugu Khan from advancing further and crushing Muslims in Africa proper.

Allah Almighty is the best of planners indeed.

@PakFactor
@RescueRanger
@aziqbal
@Foinikas
@MastanKhan

The Muslim world would suddenly have looked differently and most likely much better than it currently does. With the barbaric and senseless Sack of Baghdad, the era of the Islamic Golden Age came to an end and so did the dominant (world position) of the Muslim world. Also it kickstarted the decline of the Muslim world in terms of science and progress overall.

Quite a catastrophe.

However it is ironic that there is apparently just around 10 million Mongols worldwide (most don't even live in Mongolia where just 3 million people live but in China). This is how many people there are in Baghdad as of 2022. Some food for thought.

Europe came out of multiple conflicts, a fractured Europe, and two World Wars. Yet they are the leaders in scientific, technological, and economic fields. It's who your leaders are when a nation is born, a coin is tossed, either you are dishing it out or taking it in; it's a cruel fate. We had no excuses; even today, you look at Pakistan. What's its reason?

Anyway we cannot generalize, everyone had their bad contributions to humanity (looking at it in hindsight) but the Mongols were in a league of their own.

I mean what did they even leave in terms of influence, architecture, culture, language, cuisine etc.? Everywhere where they settled they became a part of the society. Whether Arabized, Persianized, "Indianized" (MUghals) (in lack of better words), Russified etc.

Are there even any ancient artefacts in Mongolia proper? I have never heard about that. Not even a single remnant or monument or grave of their greatest ruler Genghis Khan.

I always say about the Mongols that they came abruptly with unseen brutality and left as quickly without much to show for other than their brutality and destruction that they left behind.

I've been against this art, culture, and language nonsense from the beginning. Ultimately, it doesn't save anyone who invested time and money into this. The Taj Mahal building its cost could've been used to create approx. 17 Hardvard-style schools, some arms development, and research. What has the architecture gotten us, except enslavement from a country that's a floating Island 12,000 miles away?

I know GK was brutal, but I salute that man day and night.

He might not have left behind those sentimental things, but centuries later, his name invokes fear. More people know him than the Red Fort standing in Lahore and the Bad-Shah Majid, among other things.

 

[Srinivas]

Hi,

Pakistansi are lying to themselves again---. It was not for the muslim uniting---but the muslims were not prepared for the threat of the mongols.

Before Hulugu Khan had killed the Khalifah of baghdad after finding his wealth---he was known to have stated " if you had spent this gold to prepare for an army---you would not be begging for your life---.

As for Ain-jaloot victory---the muslims are bragging about it---.

Just like christians brag about defeating the mongols in europe---.

At ain jaloot---muslims faced an INFERIOR mongol army under an INFERIOR mongol general---.

Hulugu Khan had been called back to Karakurum----due to a power struggle for the seat of the leadership of the mongols---.

Correct, for all the barbarism they perpetrated against their enemies, mongols are smart thinkers and good at war diplomacy.

They are unstoppable war machine back in 1200’s. It is the internal reasons and vast empire to manage that stopped them conquering full of Europe and North Africa.

Turks are no different to Mongols both used same tactics and also known for barbarism.

 

[LeGenD]

Had Saladin came a little later he would have handed the Mongols their defeat

his armies were light and fast, they used diversion and hit and run tactics very well

however the Mamluks did what no one else could do, they defeated the Mongol Heavy Calvary in close combat

I covered the part of Mamluks in my other posts:

The Mongol Destruction of Baghdad

LOL... Europeans lost completely to Saladin and therefore would like to think their defeater is the most powerful. The Europeans didn't lose to Saladin; they had a truce for three years called the Ramla Agreement, also called The Treaty of Jaffa. The purpose of this treaty was for the Muslim...

defence.pk

Saladin deserve much praise and credit for recovering Jerusalem from the crusaders, but he wasn't the most capable tactician of his time.

Richard the Lionheart defeated Saladin in the Battle of Arsuf while enroute to Jaffa in 1191 AD. Richard's plan was to take control of Jaffa and he succeeded to this end.

Richard the Lionheart defeated Saladin again in the Battle of Jaffa in 1192 AD, but he was under pressure to return to England to save his throne and settled for the Treaty of Jaffa with Saladin instead. Richard had to abandon his plan to retake Jerusalem by extension.

All praise and credit to Allah Almighty for creating circumstances that favored Saladin for his cause to liberate Jerusalem.

The great Khan(s) of the Mongols demonstrated some of the most complex and cleverly executed battlefield tactics in human history - every historian will attest to this fact. They defeated some of the largest armies that could be put together by various leaders in their time.

Genghis Khan's invasion and conquest of the mighty Khwarizmian Empire is a role model of the art of warfare which is credited for providing ideas about modern operational concepts.

Genghis Khan and 13th-Century AirLand Battle

It is OK to celebrate Islamic heroes for their impressive achievements but I do not get the need to OVERHYPE them.

Allah Almighty have warned that he dislikes arrogance and corruption. He have his ways to humble those who are arrogant and/or corrupt. WE should keep this in mind.

"I am the punishment of God...If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you." - Genghis Khan.

I am glad that Saladin existed in a different time.

 

[Goritoes]

Baybars did not defeat one of the great Khans in the battlefield. They capitalized on a Mongolian crisis period to their advantage to recover some of the lands lost to Mongols.

They were lucky because if Mongols attacks Sarasans with their full might, the results would be much different. But they Planned and Allah Plan, and Allah is the best Planner.

 

[khansaheeb]

many people have little understanding of Saladin as a person and his personality and why certain things happened

Saladin dealt with his enemies in accordance with who they were

He gave Richard the Lion Heart a horse when he was about to be killed and offered to marry his son to his daughter in exchange for coastal cities as Dowry

However he beheaded Reginald De Chatillon in a instant when he insulated our beloved Prophet Muhammed SAW

He never killed the King next to him saying Kings do not kill Kings

Saladin was a merciful leader who did not kill more than who he needed to however at the Battle of Hittin he wiped out the crusaders

600,000 crusaders, historians mention when you looked at them alive you could never image they would ever die

after Saladin was done you could never image anyone of them was ever lived

Mongols strong point was their heavy Calvary and extremely strong head on charges, this is a mirror image of the Crusaders Christians

Saladins armies would wipe the floor with Mongols, he never won by strength or numbers, but mastery in military tactics using geography to his advantage and his arches were the best in the World

Building bridges to cut off fleeing boats shows how strategically clever the Mongols were. The world was not ready for this breed of military men that's why they conquered so many. It is recorded that the Mongols threw all the books from Baghdad library and blocked the flow of the river Tigris. What I don't I like about the video is the cheap comment that the Baghdad's knowledge was based around Plato and Aristotle, wtf is up with these Europeans who parrot the same crap.

 

[IblinI]

Genghis Khan's invasion and conquest of the mighty Khwarizmian Empire

To be honest, Khwarizmian at the time is a newly emerging power not long before Mongol's conquest and the newly conquered people hasn't fully integrated into the empire yet, plus the Empire itself isn't the type of fully centralized state ( at least compared to the East Asia standard) with a lots of power still in the hands of the queen mother, Turkan Khatun and her family members.

They would not be wiped out in such short amount of times considered they were still a young empire.

 

[PakFactor]

I covered the part of Mamluks in my other posts:

The Mongol Destruction of Baghdad

LOL... Europeans lost completely to Saladin and therefore would like to think their defeater is the most powerful. The Europeans didn't lose to Saladin; they had a truce for three years called the Ramla Agreement, also called The Treaty of Jaffa. The purpose of this treaty was for the Muslim...

defence.pk

Saladin deserve much praise and credit for recovering Jerusalem from the crusaders, but he wasn't the most capable tactician of his time.

Richard the Lionheart defeated Saladin in the Battle of Arsuf while enroute to Jaffa in 1191 AD. Richard's plan was to take control of Jaffa and he succeeded to this end.

Richard the Lionheart defeated Saladin again in the Battle of Jaffa in 1192 AD, but he was under pressure to return to England to save his throne and settled for the Treaty of Jaffa with Saladin instead. Richard had to abandon his plan to retake Jerusalem by extension.

All praise and credit to Allah Almighty for creating circumstances that favored Saladin for his cause to liberate Jerusalem.

The great Khan(s) of the Mongols demonstrated some of the most complex and cleverly executed battlefield tactics in human history - every historian will attest to this fact. They defeated some of the largest armies that could be put together by various leaders in their time.

Genghis Khan's invasion and conquest of the mighty Khwarizmian Empire is a role model of the art of warfare which is credited for providing ideas about modern operational concepts.

Genghis Khan and 13th-Century AirLand Battle

It is OK to celebrate Islamic heroes for their impressive achievements but I do not get the need to OVERHYPE them.

Allah Almighty have warned that he dislikes arrogance and corruption. He have his ways to humble those who are arrogant and/or corrupt. WE should keep this in mind.

"I am the punishment of God...If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you." - Genghis Khan.

I am glad that Saladin existed in a different time.

I have been trying to explain what you wrote to him, few pages back and wrote a lengthy post regarding Jaffa, but he fails to understand unless he's doing it on purpose.

That link was an excellent read and should be bookmarked by everyone and read regularly. Thanks for sharing.

Allah has his ways to humble people no doubt about it.