Tejas still to match modern fighters

[PakGuns]

terrorist state of india has so much obsession with word "indigenous" sometimes i feel like they have unleashed some dogs on online "paviter" forums like defence.pk to bark "indigenous" indigenous all day long ...

 

[undercover JIX]

terrorist state of india has so much obsession with word "indigenous" sometimes i feel like they have unleashed some dogs on online "paviter" forums like defence.pk to bark "indigenous" indigenous all day long ...

What is Indigenous about Tejas??? Design?Engine?Weapon System?@avionics??? everything is imported and / or copied.

indigenous
/ɪnˈdɪdʒɪnəs/
Learn to pronounce
adjective

1. originating or occurring naturally in a particular place; native.
   "the indigenous peoples of Siberia"
   synonyms: native, aboriginal, local; More

 

[Ultima Thule]

JF 17 has as much Pakistani contribution, as Su 30 MKI has, Indian.

If one were to ask Pakistan, exactly which parts of Jf -17 they designed, they will not be able to answer.

Why you always bring JF-17 to this topic, stick to the topic @Osiris

 

[PakGuns]

and btw back then when tow powered teja was in development these online terrorists used to compare it with EFT and Rafael.... ab yad ata hae wo zamana tau bs hasa e nikal jata he...

 

[Osiris]

We took place Research & development phase of JF-17 PAF sent its engineers to China, and by the way China built JF-17 according to Pakistan/PAF specification, and what is INDIGENOUS in 1000000000000 Gen junk jet, which rejected by your both IAF/navy in current form MK1, that's why you HAL is already working next version of your tatti Tej@$$ named MK-1A, MK-2 because IAF/IN is not satisfied from the performance of MK-1 @Osiris

And Su-30 MKI was designed as per Indian specifications(as you can see, it is different from Chinese Su -30 MK) , It has Indian components. India paid for its R&D, plus it is manufactured completely in India.

So what makes, JF -17 more Pakistani, than Su 30 MKI, Indian ?

The fact is, you did not design any part JF 17 in Pakistan, Chinese designed the entire plane as per Pakistani specifications, for at that time, you were its only customer and then gave you technology transfer.

So now certain percentage of Jf -17 parts are manufactured in Pakistan and then assembled with Chinese supplied parts.

I ask, what makes you look down on Tejas programme when you, have not even achieved that capability.

 

[undercover JIX]

And Su-30 MKI was designed as per Indian specifications(as you can see, it is different from Chinese Su -30 MK) , It has Indian components. India paid for its R&D, plus it is manufactured completely in India.

So what makes, JF -17 more Pakistani, than Su 30 MKI, Indian ?

The fact is, you did not design any part JF 17 in Pakistan, Chinese designed the entire plane as per Pakistani specifications, for at that time, you were its only customer and then gave you technology transfer.

So now certain percentage of Jf -17 parts are manufactured in Pakistan and then assembled with Chinese supplied parts.

I ask, what makes you look down on Tejas programme when you, have not even achieved that capability.

I gave you the simple answer in post #23. Pakistan is claiming what it is and not like India fake Indigenous claims.

Your stupidity to continue off topic is amusing.

 

[Osiris]

I gave you the simple answer in post #23. Pakistan is claiming what it is and not like India fake Indigenous claims.

Your stupidity to continue off topic is amusing.

Actually you did not, you claimed it is a joint venture, but only on paper.

In reality it's a fully Chinese designed aircraft, paid in half by Pakistan, who's certain parts are now being manufactured in Pakistan after transfer of technology.

Back on topic, only laugh at Tejas, once you achieved capability to even a design an aircraft.

 

[UmairNawaz]

Tejas had the possibility to be a good jet but was I don't think people are going to be buying expensive new build jets when NATO countries will be selling all their F-16s for much cheaper. Doesn't Tejas have ISTAR from US parts?

 

[undercover JIX]

but only on paper.

and you are still looking for parts for Tejas, can not even assemble professionally, parts falling mid air.

Tejas design Copied, parts imported and still failed after 40 years. incompetent fools.
Please read the articles posted and then talk.

TEJAS Light Combat Aircraft: The not so Indian fighter

Despite being in the works since 1983, the fighter is nowhere near indigenisation and almost 70% of the aircraft’s systems still need to be imported.

The Air Force has decided to place an order for 100 new and improved Tejas Light Combat Aircraft. However, despite being in the works since 1983, the light fighter is nowhere near indigenisation and almost 70% of the aircraft’s systems still need to be imported.

An audit by the CAG brought out that despite claims that only 35% of the fighter depends on foreign systems, the actual figure is closer to 70%.

Engine:
Effort to develop the Kaveri engine failed, forcing the purchase of GE 404 power plants from the US.

Flight control system actuators:
Considerable development delay leads to purchase from foreign sources.

Multi-mode radar:
Joint HAL-LRDE project failed, Israeli company roped in.

Radome:
Initially developed by ASL, failed to meet standards, imported from the UK.

THE DEFICIENCIES

The Air Force and Comptroller and Auditor General identified the following glaring deficiencies in the fighter:

Lack of a trainer:
The LCA still does not have a certified trainer version to coach pilots.

Mission simulator:
The lack of a full-mission simulator for the aircraft also a hindrance to training.
> Increased weight, reduced internal fuel capacity, front pilot protection system weakness, reduced speed key deficiencies.
> Performance issues with the radar warning receiver and counter-measure systems.
> Original sanction for project was Rs 560 crore that has been increased to Rs 10,397 crore.

THE LCA LEGACY
In the works since 1983, the LCA project is an example of how things went off target in Indian research and development.

1983-LCA project sanctioned to replace the MiG 21 fleet. Technical specifi cations framed in 1985.
1998-Was the target date for the induction with a total projected requirement for 220 fighters.
2001-The actual first flight of the aircraft took place, five years behind schedule.
2013-It took an agonising 12 years from first flight to an initial operational clearance in which the aircraft met basic parameters.

2014-The first LCA is inducted but is still not combat worthy. Several defi ciencies remain, besides incomplete weapons tests and integration.

2015-Government asks IAF to order 100 more of an improved version of the LCA. This in addition to an earlier order for 20.

WHAT THE IAF WANTS NOW
To be able to commit fully to an order for 100 more LCA fighters, the Air Force wants these four things to be in place at the earliest:
> Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar to track incoming targets
> Integration of a long range beyond-visual-range missile
> Air-to-Air refuelling capability to enhance its range
> Modern electronic warfare capability to enhance survivability of the aircr ..

READ LINK
https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...ian-fighter/articleshow/49398335.cms?from=mdr

 

[undercover JIX]

Which part are we looking for ?

As I said, only look down upon Tejas, when you have achieved even that capability.

Until recently your entire JF -17 was imported.

JF -17 , design - Chinese, Engine - russian, avionics - Chinese, was being manufactured in China entirely, now being assembled in Pakistan, with parts imported from China.

Open a new thread on JF 17, how dumb you can be to keep bringing in JF17. Talk about Tejas in this thread.

@The Eagle @Arsalan @waz @Dubious I have tried few times to point out the topic of this thread and trolling, but I failed.
I did wrong by keep replying to troll posts, but intention was to get him on topic.
Thanks.

 

[Osiris]

and you are still looking for parts for Tejas, can not even assemble professionally, parts falling mid air.

Tejas design Copied, parts imported and still failed after 40 years. incompetent fools.
Please read the articles posted and then talk.

TEJAS Light Combat Aircraft: The not so Indian fighter

Despite being in the works since 1983, the fighter is nowhere near indigenisation and almost 70% of the aircraft’s systems still need to be imported.

The Air Force has decided to place an order for 100 new and improved Tejas Light Combat Aircraft. However, despite being in the works since 1983, the light fighter is nowhere near indigenisation and almost 70% of the aircraft’s systems still need to be imported.

An audit by the CAG brought out that despite claims that only 35% of the fighter depends on foreign systems, the actual figure is closer to 70%.

Engine:
Effort to develop the Kaveri engine failed, forcing the purchase of GE 404 power plants from the US.

Flight control system actuators:
Considerable development delay leads to purchase from foreign sources.

Multi-mode radar:
Joint HAL-LRDE project failed, Israeli company roped in.

Radome:
Initially developed by ASL, failed to meet standards, imported from the UK.

THE DEFICIENCIES

The Air Force and Comptroller and Auditor General identified the following glaring deficiencies in the fighter:

Lack of a trainer:
The LCA still does not have a certified trainer version to coach pilots.

Mission simulator:
The lack of a full-mission simulator for the aircraft also a hindrance to training.
> Increased weight, reduced internal fuel capacity, front pilot protection system weakness, reduced speed key deficiencies.
> Performance issues with the radar warning receiver and counter-measure systems.
> Original sanction for project was Rs 560 crore that has been increased to Rs 10,397 crore.

THE LCA LEGACY
In the works since 1983, the LCA project is an example of how things went off target in Indian research and development.

1983-LCA project sanctioned to replace the MiG 21 fleet. Technical specifi cations framed in 1985.
1998-Was the target date for the induction with a total projected requirement for 220 fighters.
2001-The actual first flight of the aircraft took place, five years behind schedule.
2013-It took an agonising 12 years from first flight to an initial operational clearance in which the aircraft met basic parameters.

2014-The first LCA is inducted but is still not combat worthy. Several defi ciencies remain, besides incomplete weapons tests and integration.

2015-Government asks IAF to order 100 more of an improved version of the LCA. This in addition to an earlier order for 20.

WHAT THE IAF WANTS NOW
To be able to commit fully to an order for 100 more LCA fighters, the Air Force wants these four things to be in place at the earliest:
> Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar to track incoming targets
> Integration of a long range beyond-visual-range missile
> Air-to-Air refuelling capability to enhance its range
> Modern electronic warfare capability to enhance survivability of the aircr ..

READ LINK
https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...ian-fighter/articleshow/49398335.cms?from=mdr

70% by cost needs to be imported ..which is basically Engine and Radar, and not 70% by quantity.

 

[undercover JIX]

70% by cost needs to imported ..which is basically Engine and Radar, and not 70% by quantity.

OK.

 

[Ultima Thule]

And Su-30 MKI was designed as per Indian specifications(as you can see, it is different from Chinese Su -30 MK) , It has Indian components. India paid for its R&D, plus it is manufactured completely in India.

So what makes, JF -17 more Pakistani, than Su 30 MKI, Indian ?

The fact is, you did not design any part JF 17 in Pakistan, Chinese designed the entire plane as per Pakistani specifications, for at that time, you were its only customer and then gave you technology transfer.

So now certain percentage of Jf -17 parts are manufactured in Pakistan and then assembled with Chinese supplied parts.

I ask, what makes you look down on Tejas programme when you, have not even achieved that capability.

Pakistan have different strategy/Philosophy then you LCA program, Pakistan doesn't have vast industries/research capability then India we are moving step by step in right direction, recently we open AVIATION CITY for further improve our capabilities, but you're basically China mainly design and developed JF-17 but i already told you PAF engineers/aerodynamics Scientist which took a part in the R&D phase to gain experience in China @Osiris

 

[Osiris]

Pakistan have different strategy/Philosophy then you LCA program, Pakistan doesn't have vast industries/research capability then India we are moving step by step in right direction, recently we open AVIATION CITY for further improve our capabilities, but you're basically China mainly design and developed JF-17 but i already told you PAF engineers/aerodynamics Scientist which took a part in the R&D phase to gain experience in China @Osiris

A few PAF engineers( not some Pakistani R&D agency), who don't speak mandarin, have no expertise on aircraft design(perhaps only in aircraft assembly), went to China. How much contribution can you really expect from them.

It basically boils down a to simple question, even in 2019, can Pakistan even contemplate designing and manufacturing it own aircraft from scratch ? That will show you, how much you have learnt from JF 17.

 

[Ultima Thule]

A few PAF engineers( not some Pakistani R&D agency), who don't speak mandarin, have no expertise on aircraft design(perhaps only in aircraft assembly), went to China. How much contribution can you really expect from them.

It basically boils down a to simple question, even in 2019, can Pakistan even contemplate designing and manufacturing it own aircraft from scratch ? That will show you, how much you have learnt from JF 17.

we have still haven't that capability to design/develop jet from scratch, but we are working on it, how do you know that we don't have aerodynamics scientists, there are few Pakistani private firms in Karachi and in Lahore that have hypersonic wind tunnel facilities @Osiris