Should India Start A Dialogue With The Pak Army?

[OrionHunter]

Seeing that Pakistan has a lame duck government where the Pak Army determines foreign policy especially in relation to India, would it make sense for New Delhi to open direct lines of communication with the Pakistani army instead?

Given that under Pervez Musharraf the two countries had almost concluded a Kashmir deal, talking to Rawalpindi GHQ will probably yield better dividends for both India and Pakistan. Prime Minister Narendra Modi has shown that he can deviate from the tried and tested script with regard to Pakistan.

Do you think that he should now embark on a path breaking new approach and engage with Pakistan's military instead? As for me, I think that would be the only way forward in lowering tensions and solving the Kashmir imbroglio. Otherwise it will be just more of the same.

What do you think?

 

[Sankpal]

dont think, it will be usefull

 

[Contrarian]

No.
Long term loss if we talk with PA.
Short term loss if we talk with GoP.

We must talk with GoP. And talk with PA must be routed from GoP. Eventually our goal must be utter and absolute primacy and dominance of GoP over PA.
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We have to first understand the problem of Pakistan.

The problem is the Pakistan Army. It sets itself up as the true arbiter of Islam, its sword arm and consequently uses and infuses jihad mindset in the Pakistani populace. This in turn (only partially) gives PA the 'right' to do what it wants in Pakistan as the comman people there believe "they are doing what they are for Islam, so it must be good".

A resolution with India removes everything the PA has worked so hard to gain in the last 60 years - its political power, its commercial interests, its unquestioned status in the public. And so they set up their Govt to fail, forcing all international players - from India to US, to talk directly to PA. This is a cycle, they have mastered to perfection.

The ultimate goal has to be to put Pakistan Army in its place - of policy execution, not policy formulation, using any and all means available at our disposal.
We also have to realize that our goal of doing this(for the last 50 years now) has been by means of war or ratcheting up tensions along the border - even defeating Pakistan Army militarily - only enhances PA's position in Pakistan.

Consequently, we have to change our strategy lest we become like Pakistan - doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results. We must empower and embolden every civilian Govt of Pakistan while simultaneously preparing our military...because PA will inevitably retaliate to this using either directly or using "non-state actors" and hope that we abandon our talks with the GoP.[/QUOTE]

 

[nair]

Seeing that Pakistan has a lame duck government where the Pak Army determines foreign policy especially in relation to India, would it make sense for New Delhi to open direct lines of communication with the Pakistani army instead?

Given that under Pervez Musharraf the two countries had almost concluded a Kashmir deal, talking to Rawalpindi GHQ will probably yield better dividends for both India and Pakistan. Prime Minister Narendra Modi has shown that he can deviate from the tried and tested script with regard to Pakistan.

Do you think that he should now embark on a path breaking new approach and engage with Pakistan's military instead? As for me, I think that would be the only way forward in lowering tensions and solving the Kashmir imbroglio. Otherwise it will be just more of the same.

What do you think?

Well we were pretty close in resolving Kashmir issue when Mushraff was in power.... What made mushraff different???? He was the president (with constitutional powers) and he was also the COAS...... The best bet for talk would be some one who has both powers......

But then is it right to support a dictator???? Hell No!!!!!

 

[Pulsar]

No.
Long term loss if we talk with PA.
Short term loss if we talk with GoP.

We must talk with GoP. And talk with PA must be routed from GoP. Eventually our goal must be utter and absolute primacy and dominance of GoP over PA.

What's the point? As the OP mentioned, the Army has primacy over the civil dispensation where foreign affairs are concerned, especially related to India. So then, what's the point in talking to the government? They would anyway need to consult the Pak Army before taking any decisions.

I feel, to begin with we should open back channel dialogues with the Pak Army to ease tensions, improve confidence levels and seek a way forward to address all issues - Siachen, Sir Creek, Kashmir, et al.

 

[Zarvan]

Seeing that Pakistan has a lame duck government where the Pak Army determines foreign policy especially in relation to India, would it make sense for New Delhi to open direct lines of communication with the Pakistani army instead?

Given that under Pervez Musharraf the two countries had almost concluded a Kashmir deal, talking to Rawalpindi GHQ will probably yield better dividends for both India and Pakistan. Prime Minister Narendra Modi has shown that he can deviate from the tried and tested script with regard to Pakistan.

Do you think that he should now embark on a path breaking new approach and engage with Pakistan's military instead? As for me, I think that would be the only way forward in lowering tensions and solving the Kashmir imbroglio. Otherwise it will be just more of the same.

What do you think?

Raheel Shareef has thrown Musharraf doctrine on Kashmit in garbage so you are going to get nothing

 

[OrionHunter]

Raheel Shareef has thrown Musharraf doctrine on Kashmit in garbage so you are going to get nothing

And, pray, what the dickens are YOU gonna get?

Babajee ka thuloo!!

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Nawaz visited India end modi took oath .. He was issuing stupid "aman ki ashe" statements did army object? Certainly army would have reservation just like indian army that bombed the siachin talks during manmohans rule? Meanwhile Pak army has issued only positive statements encouraging peace talks and negotiations... While we have been hearing jingoistic statements from their indian counterparts?

Anyways nobody takes Nawaz seriously .. Illegitimate government ...

 

[Sugarcane]

No, but yeah RSS should start dialogues with PA to find out some solution.

 

[Royal Jack]

This thing happens when you have weak govt.

 

[illusion8]

Well we were pretty close in resolving Kashmir issue when Mushraff was in power.... What made mushraff different???? He was the president (with constitutional powers) and he was also the COAS...... The best bet for talk would be some one who has both powers......

But then is it right to support a dictator???? Hell No!!!!!

The funny part is Mushy did a coup on Nawaz because he talked to India, someone did a coup on Mushy because he talked to India, nawaz tried to hunt out Mushy and now some are behind NS's @ss because he is hunting Mushy and because he is intending to talk to India...it's a goddamn mess which we should stay the hell out of.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

No.
Long term loss if we talk with PA.
Short term loss if we talk with GoP.

We must talk with GoP. And talk with PA must be routed from GoP. Eventually our goal must be utter and absolute primacy and dominance of GoP over PA.

none of your business kiddo....but keep dreaming

 

[Lil Mathew]

No.. As Pakistan army has no interest in peace talks.. 11 ceasefire violations in 12 days and Pak high commissioner double talk shows Pak army's lack of interest in peace talks.. They want kashmir conflict to hide their corruption and incompetence.. Pak army and its generals holds major share of wealth in Pakistan and also US army killed Osama in Abbottabad, US drones killing civilians,intelligence agencies failing to stop terrorist attacks, got a name terrorist safe heaven etc.. The list of incompetency going on.. But still Pakistani people love and respect Pakistan army than politicians and other leaders only because of Kashmir conflict.. Pak army will never leave their main card..

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Pakistan Army wants to keep Kashmir issue alive: American scholar - Economic Times
WASHINGTON: Pakistan's Army does not want the Kashmir issue to be resolved as this would pose a serious challenge to their existence and their dominance in the country's political set up, a noted American scholar has said.

"They (Pakistan Army) are not going to do a settlement on Kashmir. Why would the Army allow a process to go forward that would obviate its own politics? I think that the best that India can hope for is some version of the status quo," said C Christine Fair, author of the 'Fighting to the End: The Pakistan Army's Way of War'.

Fair warned that the Pakistan Army would again try to scuttle the renewed peace initiative between the two South Asian neighbours, reflected in Prime Minister Narendra Modi's invitation to his Pakistani counterpart Nawaz Sharif to attend his swearing in ceremony; following which the two leaders had their first bilateral dialogue.

"The (Pakistan) Army would undercut him (Sharif)... all they have to do is to have a Lashkar-e-Taiba attack... opportunity for spoilers," Fair told a Washington audience yesterday at the formal launch of her book organised by the Hudson Institute, an eminent American think-tank.

"I really do not expect much out of it (Modi-Sharif peace initiative). The attack on the Indian Consulate in Herat, which was very likely done by Lashkar-e-Taiba or Haqqani network, is a really good testing of those waters," said Fair, who is an Assistant Professor in the Security Studies at Georgetown University.

Agreed Husain Haqqani, the former Pakistan Ambassador to the US.

"Nawaz Sharif genuinely wants an opening of economic relationship with India. But does he really want to take on the business of shutting down the jihadi groups, there is no sign thereof so far," he said.

In her book, Fair writes that Pakistan's conflict with India cannot be reduced simply by resolving the Kashmir dispute.

"Its problems with India are much more capacious than the territorial conflict over Kashmir."

The book has been published by the Oxford University Press, which is also bringing its Pakistan edition, but only after changing the cover, which she said "mocks and ridicules" the Pakistani Army.

 

[Contrarian]

none of your business kiddo....but keep dreaming

It is our business. The praetorian guard must be brought down. It is responsible for much of the conflict in this part of the world.

 

[GURU DUTT]

Seeing that Pakistan has a lame duck government where the Pak Army determines foreign policy especially in relation to India, would it make sense for New Delhi to open direct lines of communication with the Pakistani army instead?

Given that under Pervez Musharraf the two countries had almost concluded a Kashmir deal, talking to Rawalpindi GHQ will probably yield better dividends for both India and Pakistan. Prime Minister Narendra Modi has shown that he can deviate from the tried and tested script with regard to Pakistan.

Do you think that he should now embark on a path breaking new approach and engage with Pakistan's military instead? As for me, I think that would be the only way forward in lowering tensions and solving the Kashmir imbroglio. Otherwise it will be just more of the same.

What do you think?

well weather someone says it or not but most in MEA and GOI or even in indian media know that there is onli one controlof pakistani foriegn policy and that is controled not From parliemnet house islamabad but GHQ in rawal pindi and any meaning ful dailog which is exeptable to both sides can onli be bargained from there talking to anybody else is a waste of time and energy and i guess now the old gaurd both in BJP & MEA have got it loud and clear