Featured QUAD is unrealistic to be NATO

[vi-va]

South Korea:

1. South Korea major threat and interest is North Korea. While the last thing South Korea want to do is threatening China core interest.
2. If South Korea did so, then simple, China will arm North Korea with second hand weapons. South Korea knew very well that confrontation with China is the worst option.

Japan

1. Japan is smart and foxy. Japan will keep using US resource, technology, market, while try to get more independence.
2. Japan lost WW2, a huge lesson to be remembered for 1000 years, conquered by US, humiliated, bombed by nukes.
3. Japan love US sincerely? God damn no.
4. US truly trust Japan? God damn no.
5. US does not tolerate Japan independence. That's the cruel reality. A lap dog is what US needed.

Aussie:

1. Aussie only 25 millions population. 12% of Pakistan, 1.7% of China population. What can Aussie do against China? Want to be bombed or conquered? Suicidal.
2. Don't forget China is Aussie biggest customer. More the second and third biggest customers combined.

India:

1. India economy is slowing down, even before pandemic. Modi can keep thumping 55" inch chest(smaller than 2014), but he must spend resource on economy, not war.
2. Modi was checkmated in Aksai Chin, tens of thousands soldiers have to be forward deployed, with a fragile supply lane. A war with China, even medium scale skirmish will make Modi's be sleepless.
3. The reality is India is facing two damn front war. The last thing India want. The best thing for Pakistan.
4. US push India to the frontline, frankly speaking, using India as cannon fodder against both China and Pakistan. US and UK are good at it, stir the milky water, making 3 nuclear powers confront on land dispute. While India will be exhausted and used as proxy.
5. I bet Modi has finally realized that US won't help India. What a fool.

US:

1. The last thing US want is India becoming another China. US would rather use India as cannon fodder.
2. US is in big trouble.
   1. Demographically and economically.
   2. Financially crisis, much worse than 2008.
   3. Pandemic will last another several month.
   4. US FED has printed trillions of dollars, debt is 21 trillions
3. US is divided, more and more like India.
4. US defense budget is high, there is no room to increase. But China is steadily increasing defense budget.
5. More importantly, US had an edge on pioneer defense technology, while China has catching up.
6. The geography favor China in West Pacific. In Cold War, there are numerous air base in West Europe. While in West Pacific, Japan, Japan, Japan.
7. The first island chain is fragile. only several air base can be used which are all targeted by China Rocket Force, thousands of missiles. Especially DF-17, Hypersonic Glide Vehicle

Long term:

1. Soviet lost Cold War. The GDP of Warsaw Pact is much smaller than NATO + Korea + Japan + Canada. Soviet facing 2-3 front war, West Europe, North East Pacific, Caucasia, Arctic Ocean.
2. China focus on West Pacific, which means US can only leverage the military force of Japan + Aussie.
3. China GNP in PPP term is much bigger than US, GNP in nominal term will surpass US in 2026 or so.
4. China long term GNP will be 2X of US, or even bigger.

International Environment:

1. No countries want Cold War, Japan doesn't, Aussie doesn't, Korea doesn't, maybe except US.
2. Soviet has not much relationship with US allies. China has more trade and commercial relationship with US allies than US itself.
3. China is the biggest single market and biggest trade partners of most countries in the world.
4. China retail market is over 6 trillions, bigger then US, and increasing much faster then US.
5. China enjoyed much better neighborhood relationship and has very close ties with all neighbors, especially Russia, Central Asia, South East Asia.

Conclusion:

1. There is no way US can isolate China.
2. The US allies actually using hedging tactic between China and US.
3. China has back safeguarded, mainly focus on one side which is West Pacific.
4. China has much greater potential to dominate West Pacific, while US has reach it's peak.
5. The geopolitics is in China favor.
6. US empire is declining, inner issues is much bigger then outer challenges.
7. US financial situation is deteriorating.

The balance of power is shifting quickly. US has already withdraw to Guam and Aussie. The first island chain is fragile, ROI is bad.

Please let me know your thought.

 

[HalfMoon]

South Korea:

1. South Korea major threat and interest is North Korea. While the last thing South Korea want to do is threatening China core interest.
2. If South Korea did so, then simple, China will arm North Korea with second hand weapons. South Korea knew very well that confrontation with China is the worst option.

Japan

1. Japan is smart and foxy. Japan will keep using US resource, technology, market, while try to get more independence.
2. Japan lost WW2, a huge lesson to be remembered for 1000 years, conquered by US, humiliated, bombed by nukes.
3. Japan love US sincerely? God damn no.
4. US truly trust Japan? God damn no.
5. US does not tolerate Japan independence. That's the cruel reality. A lap dog is what US needed.

Aussie:

1. Aussie only 25 millions population. 12% of Pakistan, 1.7% of China population. What can Aussie do against China? Want to be bombed or conquered? Suicidal.
2. Don't forget China is Aussie biggest customer. More the second and third biggest customers combined.

India:

1. India economy is slowing down, even before pandemic. Modi can keep thumping 55" inch chest(smaller than 2014), but he must spend resource on economy, not war.
2. Modi was checkmated in Aksai Chin, tens of thousands soldiers have to be forward deployed, with a fragile supply lane. A war with China, even medium scale skirmish will make Modi's be sleepless.
3. The reality is India is facing two damn front war. The last thing India want. The best thing for Pakistan.
4. US push India to the frontline, frankly speaking, using India as cannon fodder against both China and Pakistan. US and UK are good at it, stir the milky water, making 3 nuclear powers confront on land dispute. While India will be exhausted and used as proxy.
5. I bet Modi has finally realized that US won't help India. What a fool.

US:

1. The last thing US want is India becoming another China. US would rather use India as cannon fodder.
2. US is in big trouble.
   1. Demographically and economically.
   2. Financially crisis, much worse than 2008.
   3. Pandemic will last another several month.
   4. US FED has printed trillions of dollars, debt is 21 trillions
3. US is divided, more and more like India.
4. US defense budget is high, there is no room to increase. But China is steadily increasing defense budget.
5. More importantly, US had an edge on pioneer defense technology, while China has catching up.
6. The geography favor China in West Pacific. In Cold War, there are numerous air base in West Europe. While in West Pacific, Japan, Japan, Japan.
7. The first island chain is fragile. only several air base can be used which are all targeted by China Rocket Force, thousands of missiles. Especially DF-17, Hypersonic Glide Vehicle

Long term:

1. Soviet lost Cold War. The GDP of Warsaw Pact is much smaller than NATO + Korea + Japan + Canada. Soviet facing 2-3 front war, West Europe, North East Pacific, Caucasia, Arctic Ocean.
2. China focus on West Pacific, which means US can only leverage the military force of Japan + Aussie.
3. China GNP in PPP term is much bigger than US, GNP in nominal term will surpass US in 2026 or so.
4. China long term GNP will be 2X of US, or even bigger.

International Environment:

1. No countries want Cold War, Japan doesn't, Aussie doesn't, Korea doesn't, maybe except US.
2. Soviet has not much relationship with US allies. China has more trade and commercial relationship with US allies than US itself.
3. China is the biggest single market and biggest trade partners of most countries in the world.
4. China retail market is over 6 trillions, bigger then US, and increasing much faster then US.
5. China enjoyed much better neighborhood relationship and has very close ties with all neighbors, especially Russia, Central Asia, South East Asia.

Conclusion:

1. There is no way US can isolate China.
2. The US allies actually using hedging tactic between China and US.
3. China has back safeguarded, mainly focus on one side which is West Pacific.
4. China has much greater potential to dominate West Pacific, while US has reach it's peak.
5. The geopolitics is in China favor.
6. US empire is declining, inner issues is much bigger then outer challenges.
7. US financial situation is deteriorating.

The balance of power is shifting quickly. US has already withdraw to Guam and Aussie. The first island chain is fragile, ROI is bad.

Please let me know your thought.

US and China have agreed to bury the hatchet.

QUAD is dead now.

China and Pakistan know when and with whom to make peace and war.

Pakistan has weaned away Russia from India while China has weaned away US from India.

Modi & India are left to fend for themselves.

 

[SuvarnaTeja]

South Korea:

1. South Korea major threat and interest is North Korea. While the last thing South Korea want to do is threatening China core interest.
2. If South Korea did so, then simple, China will arm North Korea with second hand weapons. South Korea knew very well that confrontation with China is the worst option.

Japan

1. Japan is smart and foxy. Japan will keep using US resource, technology, market, while try to get more independence.
2. Japan lost WW2, a huge lesson to be remembered for 1000 years, conquered by US, humiliated, bombed by nukes.
3. Japan love US sincerely? God damn no.
4. US truly trust Japan? God damn no.
5. US does not tolerate Japan independence. That's the cruel reality. A lap dog is what US needed.

Aussie:

1. Aussie only 25 millions population. 12% of Pakistan, 1.7% of China population. What can Aussie do against China? Want to be bombed or conquered? Suicidal.
2. Don't forget China is Aussie biggest customer. More the second and third biggest customers combined.

India:

1. India economy is slowing down, even before pandemic. Modi can keep thumping 55" inch chest(smaller than 2014), but he must spend resource on economy, not war.
2. Modi was checkmated in Aksai Chin, tens of thousands soldiers have to be forward deployed, with a fragile supply lane. A war with China, even medium scale skirmish will make Modi's be sleepless.
3. The reality is India is facing two damn front war. The last thing India want. The best thing for Pakistan.
4. US push India to the frontline, frankly speaking, using India as cannon fodder against both China and Pakistan. US and UK are good at it, stir the milky water, making 3 nuclear powers confront on land dispute. While India will be exhausted and used as proxy.
5. I bet Modi has finally realized that US won't help India. What a fool.

US:

1. The last thing US want is India becoming another China. US would rather use India as cannon fodder.
2. US is in big trouble.
   1. Demographically and economically.
   2. Financially crisis, much worse than 2008.
   3. Pandemic will last another several month.
   4. US FED has printed trillions of dollars, debt is 21 trillions
3. US is divided, more and more like India.
4. US defense budget is high, there is no room to increase. But China is steadily increasing defense budget.
5. More importantly, US had an edge on pioneer defense technology, while China has catching up.
6. The geography favor China in West Pacific. In Cold War, there are numerous air base in West Europe. While in West Pacific, Japan, Japan, Japan.
7. The first island chain is fragile. only several air base can be used which are all targeted by China Rocket Force, thousands of missiles. Especially DF-17, Hypersonic Glide Vehicle

Long term:

1. Soviet lost Cold War. The GDP of Warsaw Pact is much smaller than NATO + Korea + Japan + Canada. Soviet facing 2-3 front war, West Europe, North East Pacific, Caucasia, Arctic Ocean.
2. China focus on West Pacific, which means US can only leverage the military force of Japan + Aussie.
3. China GNP in PPP term is much bigger than US, GNP in nominal term will surpass US in 2026 or so.
4. China long term GNP will be 2X of US, or even bigger.

International Environment:

1. No countries want Cold War, Japan doesn't, Aussie doesn't, Korea doesn't, maybe except US.
2. Soviet has not much relationship with US allies. China has more trade and commercial relationship with US allies than US itself.
3. China is the biggest single market and biggest trade partners of most countries in the world.
4. China retail market is over 6 trillions, bigger then US, and increasing much faster then US.
5. China enjoyed much better neighborhood relationship and has very close ties with all neighbors, especially Russia, Central Asia, South East Asia.

Conclusion:

1. There is no way US can isolate China.
2. The US allies actually using hedging tactic between China and US.
3. China has back safeguarded, mainly focus on one side which is West Pacific.
4. China has much greater potential to dominate West Pacific, while US has reach it's peak.
5. The geopolitics is in China favor.
6. US empire is declining, inner issues is much bigger then outer challenges.
7. US financial situation is deteriorating.

The balance of power is shifting quickly. US has already withdraw to Guam and Aussie. The first island chain is fragile, ROI is bad.

Please let me know your thought.

Quad was created by the US as a bargaining chip to negotiate a good deal with China.

Once US & China reach an agreement, US will dump India and impose crippling sanctions on India.

It is a shame that Modi & his gang have decided to throw India under the bus with this Quad nonsense.

US will never come to the aid of India like USSR did in 1971.

Quad is a one way commitment. India is obligated to support the US but the US is not obligated to support India.

 

[vi-va]

India itself is a burden and problem of US, instead of asset.
US will soon learn it.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

I have just different thought on this.

We have seen that how was US managing to Pakistan in the past. Whenever they wanted, they used to Pakistan by paying the money and military items i .e fighter aircrafts etc.

But In case of India, it is just different story! We used to be in Soviet group and our economy situation was worst during the time.

Western were not ready to give latest technology to India. We were totally depended on Soviet union for latest military items and support.

Now, Situation is totally different then before early 1990s! All major powers are in the world are ready to support India or wants support from India. (Various Reasons)

So, WHY would not India take benefits? US wants to use us against China but there is no reason to see opportunity that we can use US for military benefits.

Buy the Latest military product and technology from US. They are ready to give the name of china. Take the advantages as we can.

Since, we are paying the cash amount for such military products and not getting free money or donated military items from US. US will not be able to repeat as she done with Pakistan. We all know that US is not a trusted ally, they will leave you at any point of time.

So, it is always good to have a trusted relationship with Russia and we should maintain the strategic relationship with US and west in the future.

This is the reason I always quote that our foreign policy makers are too good.

 

[vi-va]

I have just different thought on this.

We have seen that how was US managing to Pakistan in the past. Whenever they wanted, they used to Pakistan by paying the money and military items i .e fighter aircrafts etc.

But In case of India, it is just different story! We used to be in Soviet group and our economy situation was worst during the time.

Western were not ready to give latest technology to India. We were totally depended on Soviet union for latest military items and support.

Now, Situation is totally different then before early 1990s! All major powers are in the world are ready to support India or wants support from India. (Various Reasons)

So, WHY would not India take benefits? US wants to use us against China but there is no reason to see opportunity that we can use US for military benefits.

Buy the Latest military product and technology from US. They are ready to give the name of china. Take the advantages as we can.

Since, we are paying the cash amount for such military products and not getting free money or donated military items from US. US will not be able to repeat as she done with Pakistan. We all know that US is not a trusted ally, they will leave you at any point of time.

So, it is always good to have a trusted relationship with Russia and we should maintain the strategic relationship with US and west in the future.

This is the reason I always quote that our foreign policy makers are too good.

The biggest myth India has: India can copy China's Rise. But the strength of a nation actually comes from inside.

India think being US proxy is lucrative, that's your choice, we respect that. China will counter balance India in the way India hate the most. That's our an eye for an eye policy.

When China was in India development phrase, China GDP growth rate was 10%+, investment rate, living standard improvement, education, saving rate was much higher.

India jump into Cold War will be beneficial for BJP, since BJP is Hindutva, chest thumping is the best way to collect votes, as well as blaming Congress(Nehru).

But the cost will be extremely high, 2.7 billions of people(China + India), plus 200 millions Pakistanis confrontation. I wish Hindu good luck and happy ending.

India does have a choice, united with Pakistan and China, as well as Russia to reshape the world, end the monopoly of World Police, bring peace and prosperity to all developing nations. India chose being US proxy, fine.

Edit:
The deterioration relationship with China + Pakistan under BJP/Modi actually harm India national interest.

India strategic position in the world stage free fall:

1. India cut the ties with Pakistan
2. Reduced ties with China
3. Cooler ties with Russia
4. US and the West successfully isolated India, leave India no choice but please US and West.

Now US has the freedom to sanction India for buying Russia weapons. What a good partner who always put US interest first.

Why India was trapped into such a dilemma? BJP/Modi Hindutva

Why BJP/Modi Hindutva reshaped India foreign policy? Because nationalism and Modi strong image need assertive foreign policy, or even aggressive foreign policy.

That's why I said BJP has some Nazism, just some, not the same at this stage.

I am not criticizing BJP. Actually I can feel the anxiety of India:

1. The inner disturbance
2. World stage competition
3. Media influence
4. Partisan struggle
5. Social unrest
6. Gap between between the rich and poor, and so on.

BJP is ambitious, no doubt. Modi is ambitious, no doubt. Modi need quick money to safeguard his position, he need one victory after another.

Hitler needed one victory after another as well:

1. Took back Alsace-Lorraine, no blood shed, big success
2. Merge Austria, no blood shed, big success
3. Took Sudetenland from Czechoslovakia, no blood shed, big success
4. Divide Poland with Soviet and took half of Poland, WW2

From neighboring nations perspective, BJP/Modi Hindutva Nationalism is very dangerous. That's my true feeling.

Appeasement is the worst options for China, Pakistan, Nepal, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

The biggest myth India has: India can copy China's Rise. But the strength of a nation actually comes from inside.

India think being US proxy is lucrative, that's your choice, we respect that. China will counter balance India in the way India hate the most. That's our an eye for an eye policy.

When China was in India development phrase, China GDP growth rate was 10%+, investment rate, living standard improvement, education, saving rate was much higher.

India jump into Cold War will be beneficial for BJP, since BJP is Hindutva, chest thumping is the best way to collect votes, as well as blaming Congress(Nehru).

But the cost will be extremely high, 2.7 billions of people, plus 200 millions Pakistanis. I wish Hindu good luck and happy ending.

India is not going to copy "China" at all. We are just different country and could not be possible.

What Proxy? it is India's interest to be part of In-direct member of QUAD. It is also good against the China border expansion policy but also we are aware that if WAR will start between India and China, then no one will come and fight for India.

Western and US, are very helpful for Indian economy and military power growth. Again, we are not in situation like Pakistan used to be in the past.

Can you list down the benefits will be get by INdia if she will not join to (in-direct) QUAD group? What will be china bring to India? Will they going to shut relationship with Pakistan?, Will not going to transfer missile technology? Will not going to transfer military products and items? Will not going to help on nuclear technology? will not talk against India is UN? etc...

Boss, I can list down many benefits for maintaining the strategic relationship with US and the west. But, you will not able to list down disadvantages.

For us - only challenge is to maintain the trusted relationship with Russia. This is a very crucial for us to maintain the relationship otherwise there is not disadvantage by maintaining the relationship with US.

 

[Capt. Karnage]

South Korea:

1. South Korea major threat and interest is North Korea. While the last thing South Korea want to do is threatening China core interest.
2. If South Korea did so, then simple, China will arm North Korea with second hand weapons. South Korea knew very well that confrontation with China is the worst option.

Japan

1. Japan is smart and foxy. Japan will keep using US resource, technology, market, while try to get more independence.
2. Japan lost WW2, a huge lesson to be remembered for 1000 years, conquered by US, humiliated, bombed by nukes.
3. Japan love US sincerely? God damn no.
4. US truly trust Japan? God damn no.
5. US does not tolerate Japan independence. That's the cruel reality. A lap dog is what US needed.

Aussie:

1. Aussie only 25 millions population. 12% of Pakistan, 1.7% of China population. What can Aussie do against China? Want to be bombed or conquered? Suicidal.
2. Don't forget China is Aussie biggest customer. More the second and third biggest customers combined.

India:

1. India economy is slowing down, even before pandemic. Modi can keep thumping 55" inch chest(smaller than 2014), but he must spend resource on economy, not war.
2. Modi was checkmated in Aksai Chin, tens of thousands soldiers have to be forward deployed, with a fragile supply lane. A war with China, even medium scale skirmish will make Modi's be sleepless.
3. The reality is India is facing two damn front war. The last thing India want. The best thing for Pakistan.
4. US push India to the frontline, frankly speaking, using India as cannon fodder against both China and Pakistan. US and UK are good at it, stir the milky water, making 3 nuclear powers confront on land dispute. While India will be exhausted and used as proxy.
5. I bet Modi has finally realized that US won't help India. What a fool.

US:

1. The last thing US want is India becoming another China. US would rather use India as cannon fodder.
2. US is in big trouble.
   1. Demographically and economically.
   2. Financially crisis, much worse than 2008.
   3. Pandemic will last another several month.
   4. US FED has printed trillions of dollars, debt is 21 trillions
3. US is divided, more and more like India.
4. US defense budget is high, there is no room to increase. But China is steadily increasing defense budget.
5. More importantly, US had an edge on pioneer defense technology, while China has catching up.
6. The geography favor China in West Pacific. In Cold War, there are numerous air base in West Europe. While in West Pacific, Japan, Japan, Japan.
7. The first island chain is fragile. only several air base can be used which are all targeted by China Rocket Force, thousands of missiles. Especially DF-17, Hypersonic Glide Vehicle

Long term:

1. Soviet lost Cold War. The GDP of Warsaw Pact is much smaller than NATO + Korea + Japan + Canada. Soviet facing 2-3 front war, West Europe, North East Pacific, Caucasia, Arctic Ocean.
2. China focus on West Pacific, which means US can only leverage the military force of Japan + Aussie.
3. China GNP in PPP term is much bigger than US, GNP in nominal term will surpass US in 2026 or so.
4. China long term GNP will be 2X of US, or even bigger.

International Environment:

1. No countries want Cold War, Japan doesn't, Aussie doesn't, Korea doesn't, maybe except US.
2. Soviet has not much relationship with US allies. China has more trade and commercial relationship with US allies than US itself.
3. China is the biggest single market and biggest trade partners of most countries in the world.
4. China retail market is over 6 trillions, bigger then US, and increasing much faster then US.
5. China enjoyed much better neighborhood relationship and has very close ties with all neighbors, especially Russia, Central Asia, South East Asia.

Conclusion:

1. There is no way US can isolate China.
2. The US allies actually using hedging tactic between China and US.
3. China has back safeguarded, mainly focus on one side which is West Pacific.
4. China has much greater potential to dominate West Pacific, while US has reach it's peak.
5. The geopolitics is in China favor.
6. US empire is declining, inner issues is much bigger then outer challenges.
7. US financial situation is deteriorating.

The balance of power is shifting quickly. US has already withdraw to Guam and Aussie. The first island chain is fragile, ROI is bad.

Please let me know your thought.

What have you been smoking while writing this bs?

The biggest myth India has: India can copy China's Rise. But the strength of a nation actually comes from inside.

India think being US proxy is lucrative, that's your choice, we respect that. China will counter balance India in the way India hate the most. That's our an eye for an eye policy.

When China was in India development phrase, China GDP growth rate was 10%+, investment rate, living standard improvement, education, saving rate was much higher.

India jump into Cold War will be beneficial for BJP, since BJP is Hindutva, chest thumping is the best way to collect votes, as well as blaming Congress(Nehru).

But the cost will be extremely high, 2.7 billions of people(China + India), plus 200 millions Pakistanis confrontation. I wish Hindu good luck and happy ending.

India does have a choice, united with Pakistan and China, as well as Russia to reshape the world, end the monopoly of World Police, bring peace and prosperity to all developing nations. India chose being US proxy, fine.

Edit:
The deterioration relationship with China + Pakistan under BJP/Modi actually harm India national interest.

India strategic position in the world stage free fall:

1. India cut the ties with Pakistan
2. Reduced ties with China
3. Cooler ties with Russia
4. US and the West successfully isolated India, leave India no choice but please US and West.

Now US has the freedom to sanction India for buying Russia weapons. What a good partner who always put US interest first.

Why India was trapped into such a dilemma? BJP/Modi Hindutva

Why BJP/Modi Hindutva reshaped India foreign policy? Because nationalism and Modi strong image need assertive foreign policy, or even aggressive foreign policy.

That's why I said BJP has some Nazism, just some, not the same at this stage.

I am not criticizing BJP. Actually I can feel the anxiety of India:

1. The inner disturbance
2. World stage competition
3. Media influence
4. Partisan struggle
5. Social unrest
6. Gap between between the rich and poor, and so on.

BJP is ambitious, no doubt. Modi is ambitious, no doubt. Modi need quick money to safeguard his position, he need one victory after another.

Hitler needed one victory after another as well:

1. Took back Alsace-Lorraine, no blood shed, big success
2. Merge Austria, no blood shed, big success
3. Took Sudetenland from Czechoslovakia, no blood shed, big success
4. Divide Poland with Soviet and took half of Poland, WW2

From neighboring nations perspective, BJP/Modi Hindutva Nationalism is very dangerous. That's my true feeling.

Appeasement is the worst options for China, Pakistan, Nepal, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka.

Who told you that we want to copy a copycat and thief? The thing is China has delusion that it can stand upto technologically advanced nations like the US and Japan when in reality all of its products are third class quality knockoffs and that includes weapons too. Like j10 is copy of failed Israeli Lavi project, j11 is copy of su27, j16 is su30 knockoff etc etc. Chinese have made serious miscalculations which will lead to its fall. US has just showed the commieland who is the boss, learn from the fate of huawei.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

South Korea:

1. South Korea major threat and interest is North Korea. While the last thing South Korea want to do is threatening China core interest.
2. If South Korea did so, then simple, China will arm North Korea with second hand weapons. South Korea knew very well that confrontation with China is the worst option.

Japan

1. Japan is smart and foxy. Japan will keep using US resource, technology, market, while try to get more independence.
2. Japan lost WW2, a huge lesson to be remembered for 1000 years, conquered by US, humiliated, bombed by nukes.
3. Japan love US sincerely? God damn no.
4. US truly trust Japan? God damn no.
5. US does not tolerate Japan independence. That's the cruel reality. A lap dog is what US needed.

Aussie:

1. Aussie only 25 millions population. 12% of Pakistan, 1.7% of China population. What can Aussie do against China? Want to be bombed or conquered? Suicidal.
2. Don't forget China is Aussie biggest customer. More the second and third biggest customers combined.

India:

1. India economy is slowing down, even before pandemic. Modi can keep thumping 55" inch chest(smaller than 2014), but he must spend resource on economy, not war.
2. Modi was checkmated in Aksai Chin, tens of thousands soldiers have to be forward deployed, with a fragile supply lane. A war with China, even medium scale skirmish will make Modi's be sleepless.
3. The reality is India is facing two damn front war. The last thing India want. The best thing for Pakistan.
4. US push India to the frontline, frankly speaking, using India as cannon fodder against both China and Pakistan. US and UK are good at it, stir the milky water, making 3 nuclear powers confront on land dispute. While India will be exhausted and used as proxy.
5. I bet Modi has finally realized that US won't help India. What a fool.

US:

1. The last thing US want is India becoming another China. US would rather use India as cannon fodder.
2. US is in big trouble.
   1. Demographically and economically.
   2. Financially crisis, much worse than 2008.
   3. Pandemic will last another several month.
   4. US FED has printed trillions of dollars, debt is 21 trillions
3. US is divided, more and more like India.
4. US defense budget is high, there is no room to increase. But China is steadily increasing defense budget.
5. More importantly, US had an edge on pioneer defense technology, while China has catching up.
6. The geography favor China in West Pacific. In Cold War, there are numerous air base in West Europe. While in West Pacific, Japan, Japan, Japan.
7. The first island chain is fragile. only several air base can be used which are all targeted by China Rocket Force, thousands of missiles. Especially DF-17, Hypersonic Glide Vehicle

Long term:

1. Soviet lost Cold War. The GDP of Warsaw Pact is much smaller than NATO + Korea + Japan + Canada. Soviet facing 2-3 front war, West Europe, North East Pacific, Caucasia, Arctic Ocean.
2. China focus on West Pacific, which means US can only leverage the military force of Japan + Aussie.
3. China GNP in PPP term is much bigger than US, GNP in nominal term will surpass US in 2026 or so.
4. China long term GNP will be 2X of US, or even bigger.

International Environment:

1. No countries want Cold War, Japan doesn't, Aussie doesn't, Korea doesn't, maybe except US.
2. Soviet has not much relationship with US allies. China has more trade and commercial relationship with US allies than US itself.
3. China is the biggest single market and biggest trade partners of most countries in the world.
4. China retail market is over 6 trillions, bigger then US, and increasing much faster then US.
5. China enjoyed much better neighborhood relationship and has very close ties with all neighbors, especially Russia, Central Asia, South East Asia.

Conclusion:

1. There is no way US can isolate China.
2. The US allies actually using hedging tactic between China and US.
3. China has back safeguarded, mainly focus on one side which is West Pacific.
4. China has much greater potential to dominate West Pacific, while US has reach it's peak.
5. The geopolitics is in China favor.
6. US empire is declining, inner issues is much bigger then outer challenges.
7. US financial situation is deteriorating.

The balance of power is shifting quickly. US has already withdraw to Guam and Aussie. The first island chain is fragile, ROI is bad.

Please let me know your thought.

What China does that is clever is that it sets up a battlefield to its preference prior to declaring hostilities.

This simple yet effective strategy gave China an advantage against India in Ladakh as we saw how stretched and ineffective India's supply lines were in response.

Likewise in Asia-Pacific, this "Quad" is truly a desperate attempt to level a playing field heavily tilted in China's favour. There is nothing any of these players can actually achieve against China without assuring their own economic and/or military devastation in response. The only nation that stands a chance is the USA itself, through aircraft carriers, subs and island bases and military technological supremacy. They may dress it up as a "Quad" for publicity, but everyone knows this is simply China vs USA, and China has battlefield advantage which should compensate for USA's military hardware advantage.

 

[Vapnope]

Quad was created by the US as a bargaining chip to negotiate a good deal with China.

Once US & China reach an agreement, US will dump India and impose crippling sanctions on India.

It is a shame that Modi & his gang have decided to throw India under the bus with this Quad nonsense.

US will never come to the aid of India like USSR did in 1971.

Quad is a one way commitment. India is obligated to support the US but the US is not obligated to support India.

What do you propose India should do in this case?

Western and US, are very helpful for Indian economy and military power growth.

You are right about modernization of Indian military but not about economy. West will never like you becoming a second world country because once you move up the ladder, you don't want wars on your turf which in this case is not something West wants. They would like to pitch you against China while keeping a leash on your potential growth.

 

[vi-va]

India is not going to copy "China" at all. We are just different country and could not be possible.

What Proxy? it is India's interest to be part of In-direct member of QUAD. It is also good against the China border expansion policy but also we are aware that if WAR will start between India and China, then no one will come and fight for India.

Western and US, are very helpful for Indian economy and military power growth. Again, we are not in situation like Pakistan used to be in the past.

Can you list down the benefits will be get by INdia if she will not join to (in-direct) QUAD group? What will be china bring to India? Will they going to shut relationship with Pakistan?, Will not going to transfer missile technology? Will not going to transfer military products and items? Will not going to help on nuclear technology? will not talk against India is UN? etc...

Boss, I can list down many benefits for maintaining the strategic relationship with US and the west. But, you will not able to list down disadvantages.

For us - only challenge is to maintain the trusted relationship with Russia. This is a very crucial for us to maintain the relationship otherwise there is not disadvantage by maintaining the relationship with US.

I have edited my post, see above.

1. China has no issues on India US ties. India can have good relationship with US, or any other countries, commercial or non commercial.
2. India bought weapons from Russia for decades, did China ever object? Never. China still have good relationship with Russia. Your money, your choice.
3. India buying weapons from US, totally fine, your money, your choice.

The thing is, US formally organized a military alliance against China, explicitly, publicly, which including US + Japan + Aussie. They are treaty alliance militarily.
Should China object? Off course yes.

Now US invited India to join the alliance, will US sign military treaty with India and protect India north and west border? Will India allow US deploy military base in Kashmir? No. Then what is it?

The QUAD blah, blah, blah has no substance. It's a trap, the target is India.

1. Deteriorate India Pakistan relationship, isolate Pakistan
2. Deteriorate India China relationship, isolate China
3. Allure India to alienate Russia
4. With #1, #2 and #3 achieved, India was isolated by neighbors and major non-western powers.

This is quite a game, politics. There are no permanent enemies, and no permanent friends, only permanent interests.

So in the international system, when India has no friends but West, you knew what West will do to you.

Basically India was/is/will be a prey of US and West. That's the consequence of BJP/Modi foreign policy, when BJP/Modi shift away from independence foreign policy and jump into QUAD.

Let's see what west did to India in past several years when US had the leverage:

1. US ended Most Favored Nation Principle (MFN) for India
2. US sanction/threaten to sanction India for buying Russia S-400
3. US force/pressure India to purchase highly over priced 30 MQ-9B Predator for $3 billion, 100 millions each.
4. India purchased 36 new Rafale fighter jets in a 7.87 billion euro, 200 millions each.
5. India can't buy Iran oil, otherwise sanctions followed. While China keep buying in smaller volume.
6. India was out of Afghanistan Peace Negotiation, not invited to Moscow, while Pakistan and China was there.
7. India keep buying China product as usual, India trade war with China has little pressure on China economy and zero influence on China foreign policy.
8. There is no western aids to help India building nation, no technology transfer, no industry shifted from China to India.
9. India was out of RCEP.
10. India was out of CPTPP
11. EU agreed on Comprehensive Agreement on Investment with China.

What India got was praise/support on Media, just lip service.

The world run by power, real power. Economy power, military power, technology power, others are just make up.

Quote from Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov:
The Russian foreign minister had said India was “currently an object of the Western countries’ persistent, aggressive and devious policy as they are trying to engage it in anti-China games..."

India Pulls Focus to 'Independent Foreign Policy' in Response to Lavrov's 'Anti-China Camp' Claim

The Russian foreign minister had said India was “currently an object of the Western countries’ persistent, aggressive and devious policy as they are trying to engage it in anti-China games..."

thewire.in

What do you propose India should do in this case?

You are right about modernization of Indian military but not about economy. West will never like you becoming a second world country because once you move up the ladder, you don't want wars on your turf which in this case is not something West wants. They would like to pitch you against China while keeping a leash on your potential growth.

The last thing West want is another China. India becoming another China will be nightmare of west.

Just think about it, there is only one earth, which is the pie. If India become another China, will India eat her share of pie or just be hungry and let west keep eating?

How much resource China consumed in past decades? Oil, gas, minerals, food, energy? Will India pressure herself for consuming less, or pressure competitors and grab more?

China invest, trade with Africa a lot, for resource and market, will India do the same if India is stronger and stronger?

Funny India strategic thinking.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

I have edited my post, see above.

1. China has no issues on India US ties. India can have good relationship with US, or any other countries, commercial or non commercial.
2. India bought weapons from Russia for decades, did China ever object? Never. China still have good relationship with Russia. Your money, your choice.
3. India buying weapons from US, totally fine, your money, your choice.

The thing is, US formally organized a military alliance against China, explicitly, publicly, which including US + Japan + Aussie. They are treaty alliance militarily.
Should China object? Off course yes.

Now US invited India to join the alliance, will US sign military treaty with India and protect India north and west border? Will India allow US deploy military base in Kashmir? No. Then what is it?

The QUAD blah, blah, blah has no substance. It's a trap, the target is India.

1. Deteriorate India Pakistan relationship, isolate Pakistan
2. Deteriorate India China relationship, isolate China
3. Allure India to alienate Russia
4. With #1, #2 and #3 achieved, India was isolated by neighbors and major non-western powers.

This is quite a game, politics. There are no permanent enemies, and no permanent friends, only permanent interests.

So in the international system, when India has no friends but West, you knew what West will do to you.

Basically India was/is/will be a prey of US and West. That's the consequence of BJP/Modi foreign policy, when BJP/Modi shift away from independence foreign policy and jump into QUAD.

Let's see what west did to India in past several years when US had the leverage:

1. US ended Most Favored Nation Principle (MFN) for India
2. US sanction/threaten to sanction India for buying Russia S-400
3. US force/pressure India to purchase highly over priced 30 MQ-9B Predator for $3 billion, 100 millions each.
4. India purchased 36 new Rafale fighter jets in a 7.87 billion euro, 200 millions each.
5. India can't buy Iran oil, otherwise sanctions followed. While China keep buying in smaller volume.
6. India was out of Afghanistan Peace Negotiation, not invited to Moscow, while Pakistan and China was there.
7. India keep buying China product as usual, India trade war with China has little pressure on China economy and zero influence on China foreign policy.
8. There is no western aids to help India building nation, no technology transfer, no industry shifted from China to India.
9. India was out of RCEP.
10. India was out of CPTPP
11. EU agreed on Comprehensive Agreement on Investment with China.

What India got was praise/support on Media, just lip service.

The world run by power, real power. Economy power, military power, technology power, others are just make up.

Quote from Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov:
The Russian foreign minister had said India was “currently an object of the Western countries’ persistent, aggressive and devious policy as they are trying to engage it in anti-China games..."
View attachment 726473

India Pulls Focus to 'Independent Foreign Policy' in Response to Lavrov's 'Anti-China Camp' Claim

The Russian foreign minister had said India was “currently an object of the Western countries’ persistent, aggressive and devious policy as they are trying to engage it in anti-China games..."

thewire.in

The last thing West want is another China. India becoming another China will be nightmare of west.

Just think about it, there is only one earth, which is the pie. If India become another China, will India eat her share of pie or just be hungry and let west keep eating?

How much resource China consumed in past decades? Oil, gas, minerals, food, energy? Will India pressure herself for consuming less, or pressure competitors and grab more?

China invest, trade with Africa a lot, for resource and market, will India do the same if India is stronger and stronger?

Funny India strategic thinking.

The thing is, US formally organized a military alliance against China, explicitly, publicly, which including US + Japan + Aussie. They are treaty alliance militarily.
Should China object? Off course yes.

==> yes, you have rights to reaction.


Now US invited India to join the alliance, will US sign military treaty with India and protect India north and west border? Will India allow US deploy military base in Kashmir? No. Then what is it?

==> NO, We dont need any Military treaty with anyone against The china. India is more then suffient to manage China. The real question is that does China ready for nuclear War with India or for anyone against India? The answer "NO"


The QUAD blah, blah, blah has no substance. It's a trap, the target is India.

1. Deteriorate India Pakistan relationship, isolate Pakistan

==> Wrong! Pakistan is not bringing anything to US and if again US will require Pakistan then they will give more preference to pakistan just they did in the past.

1. Deteriorate India China relationship, isolate China

===> Yes, it is against the CHina.

1. Allure India to alienate Russia

===> No, we are having independent foreign policy, We are not going to leave Russia for anyone.

1. With #1, #2 and #3 achieved, India was isolated by neighbors and major non-western powers.

===> What does mean by neighbors? We already have good relationship with others except CHina and Pakistan. It will not change if we join or not join.

This is quite a game, politics. There are no permanent enemies, and no permanent friends, only permanent interests.

So in the international system, when India has no friends but West, you knew what West will do to you.

===> Agreed! the same reason we follow the own interest. read the history properly. We don't believe on friendship, in the world " No one is friend including Pakistan and CHina"


et's see what west did to India in past several years when US had the leverage:

1. US ended Most Favored Nation Principle (MFN) for India
2. US sanction/threaten to sanction India for buying Russia S-400
3. US force/pressure India to purchase highly over priced 30 MQ-9B Predator for $3 billion, 100 millions each.
4. India purchased 36 new Rafale fighter jets in a 7.87 billion euro, 200 millions each.
5. India can't buy Iran oil, otherwise sanctions followed. While China keep buying in smaller volume.
6. India was out of Afghanistan Peace Negotiation, not invited to Moscow, while Pakistan and China was there.
7. India keep buying China product as usual, India trade war with China has little pressure on China economy and zero influence on China foreign policy.
8. There is no western aids to help India building nation, no technology transfer, no industry shifted from China to India.
9. India was out of RCEP.
10. India was out of CPTPP
11. EU agreed on Comprehensive Agreement on Investment with China.

=====> Not related to QUAD or relationship with CHina. Since we have issues in the borders from past many decades and strengthen our military is in our interest. Most of the points are not related to joining the quad. We join or not join - situations will be remain the same.


What India got was praise/support on Media, just lip service.

The world run by power, real power. Economy power, military power, technology power, others are just make u

======> Again, We know our strength and power. We don't need lip service from anyone. We are doing what is best for us.

The last thing West want is another China. India becoming another China will be nightmare of west.

Just think about it, there is only one earth, which is the pie. If India become another China, will India eat her share of pie or just be hungry and let west keep eating?

How much resource China consumed in past decades? Oil, gas, minerals, food, energy? Will India pressure herself for consuming less, or pressure competitors and grab more?

China invest, trade with Africa a lot, for resource and market, will India do the same if India is stronger and stronger?

======> Again, give credit where is due! I always give credit to China for their growth and sometimes give example to my friends during the discussion.

But again! It is in India's interest to maintain a strategic relationship with US and West.

China is arming to Pakistan against to India from decades even India was not having strategic relationship with US. So now, India is playing the same game and getting arms and maintaining the relationship against the China then now China is shouting and saying, Blah blah blah...

Cuba incident is a good example!
it is resolved after removal of American nuclear missiles from Turkey and Italy and removal of the Soviet Union's nuclear missiles from Cuba. (Compromised by both Sides), one side never get compromised usually.

It is like give and take! China is not bringing anything to India If India will not be part of QUAD, The real question "What will china bring for India?"

Ans is nothing! So, it is our interest to take benefits from US and west by in-direct joining to them against China.

 

[vi-va]

The thing is, US formally organized a military alliance against China, explicitly, publicly, which including US + Japan + Aussie. They are treaty alliance militarily.
Should China object? Off course yes.

==> yes, you have rights to reaction.


Now US invited India to join the alliance, will US sign military treaty with India and protect India north and west border? Will India allow US deploy military base in Kashmir? No. Then what is it?

==> NO, We dont need any Military treaty with anyone against The china. India is more then suffient to manage China. The real question is that does China ready for nuclear War with India or for anyone against India? The answer "NO"


The QUAD blah, blah, blah has no substance. It's a trap, the target is India.

1. Deteriorate India Pakistan relationship, isolate Pakistan

==> Wrong! Pakistan is not bringing anything to US and if again US will require Pakistan then they will give more preference to pakistan just they did in the past.

1. Deteriorate India China relationship, isolate China

===> Yes, it is against the CHina.

1. Allure India to alienate Russia

===> No, we are having independent foreign policy, We are not going to leave Russia for anyone.

1. With #1, #2 and #3 achieved, India was isolated by neighbors and major non-western powers.

===> What does mean by neighbors? We already have good relationship with others except CHina and Pakistan. It will not change if we join or not join.

This is quite a game, politics. There are no permanent enemies, and no permanent friends, only permanent interests.

So in the international system, when India has no friends but West, you knew what West will do to you.

===> Agreed! the same reason we follow the own interest. read the history properly. We don't believe on friendship, in the world " No one is friend including Pakistan and CHina"


et's see what west did to India in past several years when US had the leverage:

1. US ended Most Favored Nation Principle (MFN) for India
2. US sanction/threaten to sanction India for buying Russia S-400
3. US force/pressure India to purchase highly over priced 30 MQ-9B Predator for $3 billion, 100 millions each.
4. India purchased 36 new Rafale fighter jets in a 7.87 billion euro, 200 millions each.
5. India can't buy Iran oil, otherwise sanctions followed. While China keep buying in smaller volume.
6. India was out of Afghanistan Peace Negotiation, not invited to Moscow, while Pakistan and China was there.
7. India keep buying China product as usual, India trade war with China has little pressure on China economy and zero influence on China foreign policy.
8. There is no western aids to help India building nation, no technology transfer, no industry shifted from China to India.
9. India was out of RCEP.
10. India was out of CPTPP
11. EU agreed on Comprehensive Agreement on Investment with China.

=====> Not related to QUAD or relationship with CHina. Since we have issues in the borders from past many decades and strengthen our military is in our interest. Most of the points are not related to joining the quad. We join or not join - situations will be remain the same.


What India got was praise/support on Media, just lip service.

The world run by power, real power. Economy power, military power, technology power, others are just make u

======> Again, We know our strength and power. We don't need lip service from anyone. We are doing what is best for us.

The last thing West want is another China. India becoming another China will be nightmare of west.

Just think about it, there is only one earth, which is the pie. If India become another China, will India eat her share of pie or just be hungry and let west keep eating?

How much resource China consumed in past decades? Oil, gas, minerals, food, energy? Will India pressure herself for consuming less, or pressure competitors and grab more?

China invest, trade with Africa a lot, for resource and market, will India do the same if India is stronger and stronger?

======> Again, give credit where is due! I always give credit to China for their growth and sometimes give example to my friends during the discussion.

But again! It is in India's interest to maintain a strategic relationship with US and West.

China is arming to Pakistan against to India from decades even India was not having strategic relationship with US. So now, India is playing the same game and getting arms and maintaining the relationship against the China then now China is shouting and saying, Blah blah blah...

Cuba incident is a good example!
it is resolved after removal of American nuclear missiles from Turkey and Italy and removal of the Soviet Union's nuclear missiles from Cuba. (Compromised by both Sides), one side never get compromised usually.

It is like give and take! China is not bringing anything to India If India will not be part of QUAD, The real question "What will china bring for India?"

Ans is nothing! So, it is our interest to take benefits from US and west by in-direct joining to them against China.

What will China bring to India? China doesn't owe you anything, why should we bring you anything?

No one owe India anything. India can earn anything you want by yourself, this is self-help international system, no one will do you a favor for free, literally no one, including the West.

1. India in the regions facing China and Pakistan two fronts, India has lower hand. So no one would like to beg for peace.
2. India politically is not P5
3. India commercially trade volume not much
4. India technologically not advanced
5. India financially is loaner not lender.
6. India is not resourceful country, no one need India oil or gas or ore, or rare earth, nothing.

From China perspective:

1. Politically China is P5
2. Commercially India is a very small market, trade volume with China is only tens of billions, account for 2% of China trade volume.
3. Financially China is lender, while India is loaner.
4. Technologically China is much more advanced.
5. China need oil, gas, ore, while China import elsewhere instead of India
6. Militarily China is much stronger.

China doesn't need India for anything, we don't ask for mercy, we don't ask for prosperity, we don't ask for aid.

On the other hand, China along with Pakistan can pressure India militarily as we are doing it right now.

This is the cold reality.

India want peace, prosperity, then fix relationship with both China and Pakistan.

India want to use useless QUAD to threaten China, no chance. India Army checkmated in Aksai Chin right now, they are actually hostage of Chinese.

 

[Chakar The Great]

The biggest myth India has: India can copy China's Rise. But the strength of a nation actually comes from inside.

India think being US proxy is lucrative, that's your choice, we respect that. China will counter balance India in the way India hate the most. That's our an eye for an eye policy.

When China was in India development phrase, China GDP growth rate was 10%+, investment rate, living standard improvement, education, saving rate was much higher.

India jump into Cold War will be beneficial for BJP, since BJP is Hindutva, chest thumping is the best way to collect votes, as well as blaming Congress(Nehru).

But the cost will be extremely high, 2.7 billions of people(China + India), plus 200 millions Pakistanis confrontation. I wish Hindu good luck and happy ending.

India does have a choice, united with Pakistan and China, as well as Russia to reshape the world, end the monopoly of World Police, bring peace and prosperity to all developing nations. India chose being US proxy, fine.

Edit:
The deterioration relationship with China + Pakistan under BJP/Modi actually harm India national interest.

India strategic position in the world stage free fall:

1. India cut the ties with Pakistan
2. Reduced ties with China
3. Cooler ties with Russia
4. US and the West successfully isolated India, leave India no choice but please US and West.

Now US has the freedom to sanction India for buying Russia weapons. What a good partner who always put US interest first.

Why India was trapped into such a dilemma? BJP/Modi Hindutva

Why BJP/Modi Hindutva reshaped India foreign policy? Because nationalism and Modi strong image need assertive foreign policy, or even aggressive foreign policy.

That's why I said BJP has some Nazism, just some, not the same at this stage.

I am not criticizing BJP. Actually I can feel the anxiety of India:

1. The inner disturbance
2. World stage competition
3. Media influence
4. Partisan struggle
5. Social unrest
6. Gap between between the rich and poor, and so on.

BJP is ambitious, no doubt. Modi is ambitious, no doubt. Modi need quick money to safeguard his position, he need one victory after another.

Hitler needed one victory after another as well:

1. Took back Alsace-Lorraine, no blood shed, big success
2. Merge Austria, no blood shed, big success
3. Took Sudetenland from Czechoslovakia, no blood shed, big success
4. Divide Poland with Soviet and took half of Poland, WW2

From neighboring nations perspective, BJP/Modi Hindutva Nationalism is very dangerous. That's my true feeling.

Appeasement is the worst options for China, Pakistan, Nepal, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka.

Some really impressive points made. Those are facts!!

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

What will China bring to India? China doesn't owe you anything, why should we bring you anything?

No one owe India anything. India can earn anything you want by yourself, this is self-help international system, no one will do you a favor for free, literally no one, including the West.

1. India in the regions facing China and Pakistan two fronts, India has lower hand. So no one would like to beg for peace.
2. India politically is not P5
3. India commercially trade volume not much
4. India technologically not advanced
5. India financially is loaner not lender.
6. India is not resourceful country, no one need India oil or gas or ore, or rare earth, nothing.

From China perspective:

1. Politically China is P5
2. Commercially India is a very small market, trade volume with China is only tens of billions, account for 2% of China trade volume.
3. Financially China is lender, while India is loaner.
4. Technologically China is much more advanced.
5. China need oil, gas, ore, while China import elsewhere instead of India
6. Militarily China is much stronger.

China doesn't need India for anything, we don't ask for mercy, we don't ask for prosperity, we don't ask for aid.

On the other hand, China along with Pakistan can pressure India militarily as we are doing it right now.

This is the cold reality.

India want peace, prosperity, then fix relationship with both China and Pakistan.

India want to use useless QUAD to threaten China, no chance. India Army checkmated in Aksai Chin right now, they are actually hostage of Chinese.

What is related to QUAD on your points?????

China and Pakistan is free to pressure, by the way, I don't count Pakistan on this. Only politicians and army can make statements to make happy to their people.

Regarding China, China is a paper tiger and nothing more!

All your points are justifying to that we should be part of In-directly to QUAD. I don't find any disadvantage by join the group except might will face harden in relationship with Russia.