Pakistan to build a Nuclear submarine

[Bobby]

http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ment-plan-2025-says-report-4.html#post4352668

This kind of news put a big question mark on development of Nuclear submarine

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ment-plan-2025-says-report-4.html#post4352668

This kind of news put a big question mark on development of Nuclear submarine

Wouldnt cancel the prog.

 

[Bobby]

Wouldnt cancel the prog.

time will tell

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

time will tell

Time doesnt remain the same aswell...

 

[Abingdonboy]

http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ment-plan-2025-says-report-4.html#post4352668

This kind of news put a big question mark on development of Nuclear submarine

What's there to question? The program never existed. But yes, if it had, then such news (about the PAF's cutbacks) would certainly signal the indefinite delay of the PN's SSBN program. As it stands the PN's annual budget is under $600mn USD with only a fraction of this earmarked for capital expenditure. Asking a SSBN to be designed and built out of these peanuts is like asking James Cameron to make "Avatar" with $10,000 dollars and a laptop running Windows 95- it's just not going to happen.

 

[That Guy]

What's there to question? The program never existed. But yes, if it had, then such news (about the PAF's cutbacks) would certainly signal the indefinite delay of the PN's SSBN program. As it stands the PN's annual budget is under $600mn USD with only a fraction of this earmarked for capital expenditure. Asking a SSBN to be designed and built out of these peanuts is like asking James Cameron to make "Avatar" with $10,000 dollars and a laptop running Windows 95- it's just not going to happen.

Whether or not it exists, I don't know, but the PN would probably not face any cuts, as they'd be deemed too minor to make any difference. The PN is already under-budgeted as it is, the government isn't stupid enough to lower the budget any further.

Anyways, it's not impossible for Pakistan to make a nuclear sub, especially with China's assistance, so I have no doubt that there is at least a plan to build a nuclear sub in the future.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Whether or not it exists, I don't know, but the PN would probably not face any cuts, as they'd be deemed too minor to make any difference. The PN is already under-budgeted as it is, the government isn't stupid enough to lower the budget any further.

Anyways, it's not impossible for Pakistan to make a nuclear sub, especially with China's assistance, so I have no doubt that there is at least a plan to build a nuclear sub in the future.

The same question comes to mind when talking about the PN wanting SSBNs as when talking about it wanting ACCs- WHY? Why does a nation like Pakistan with a navy like the PN need or want a SSBN? There are only 6 nations who operate such vessels and does Pakistan really think it should be the 7th?

When talking operationally- what benefits does the SSBN bring to a nation like Pakistan?


It seems it is a case of tit for tat - wanting to match India's capabilities 1:1. This is for all the obvious reasons incredibly flawed and I think your military planners in Pakistan are much more sensible than this- they will look to more cost effective and Pakistan-centric solutions than a simple case of vainly attempting to stand toe to toe with India.


For Pakistan a new generation of AIP-equipped SSKs is what it needs most IMHO.


And yes, if Pakistan really wanted to it could devlop a SSBN for itself at whatever costs aka "eat grass" mentality, but does that mean it should?

 

[That Guy]

The same question comes to mind when talking about the PN wanting SSBNs as when talking about it wanting ACCs- WHY? Why does a nation like Pakistan with a navy like the PN need or want a SSBN? There are only 6 nations who operate such vessels and does Pakistan really think it should be the 7th?

When talking operationally- what benefits does the SSBN bring to a nation like Pakistan?


It seems it is a case of tit for tat - wanting to match India's capabilities 1:1. This is for all the obvious reasons incredibly flawed and I think your military planners in Pakistan are much more sensible than this- they will look to more cost effective and Pakistan-centric solutions than a simple case of vainly attempting to stand toe to toe with India.


For Pakistan a new generation of AIP-equipped SSKs is what it needs most IMHO.


And yes, if Pakistan really wanted to it could devlop a SSBN for itself at whatever costs aka "eat grass" mentality, but does that mean it should?

Again, I don't know whether such a program exists or not, nor do I know the strategic implications. All I'm talking about is capability of having such a system in place.

If such a program exists, is it a tit for tat measure? I don't think so, Pakistan has no desire for a 1:1 capability, as it knows this is an impossibility. It's more to do with not being left technologically behind by India and geopolitical implications rather than it is about actual strategic motivations.

It's kind of like nuclear weapons. India and Pakistan will never likely use them, but they can have bragging rights about having them. It's the same reason why India developed an pseudo-ICBM (Agni-V), they just want to show they have somewhat of a long range firing capability, even though the only likely enemies they face are in their immediate neighborhood.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Again, I don't know whether such a program exists or not, nor do I know the strategic implications. All I'm talking about is capability of having such a system in place.

If such a program exists, is it a tit for tat measure? I don't think so, Pakistan has no desire for a 1:1 capability, as it knows this is an impossibility. It's more to do with not being left technologically behind by India and geopolitical implications rather than it is about actual strategic motivations.

It's kind of like nuclear weapons. India and Pakistan will never likely use them, but they can have bragging rights about having them. It's the same reason why India developed an pseudo-ICBM (Agni-V), they just want to show they have somewhat of a long range firing capability, even though the only likely enemies they face are in their immediate neighborhood.

I agree with you on many counts but whatever way you cut it- SSBNs are inherently strategic assets. And it very much is a tit for tat measure if PN ever opts for such a system as they are only responding to Indian actions which, for the most part, are not even aimed at Pakistan anymore. Even the timing of this "news" (Pakistan devloping n-subs) shows this- weeks after India got their SSN "CHAKRA".

 

[That Guy]

I agree with you on many counts but whatever way you cut it- SSBNs are inherently strategic assets. And it very much is a tit for tat measure if PN ever opts for such a system as they are only responding to Indian actions which, for the most part, are not even aimed at Pakistan anymore. Even the timing of this "news" (Pakistan devloping n-subs) shows this- weeks after India got their SSN "CHAKRA".

The timing could very well be a coincidence, I do know that the intent to build an indigenous nuclear sub has been in the PN's mind for years now.

Again, it will have a strategic implication, but I just don't know what that will be. However, I again repeat that it's probably more for geopolitical and domestic consumption purposes. Kind of like Liaoning with China...

 

[S.Y.A]

i want to know if a hostile sub is spotted in territorial waters of a country, does that country has the right to sink it?

 

[IndianArmy]

i want to know if a hostile sub is spotted in territorial waters of a country, does that country has the right to sink it?

If submerged yes without a warning.
If not also Yes but with a warning or two.

 

[Chak Bamu]

What's there to question? The program never existed.

How would YOU know?

The program exists and has existed for many years. Funds are a problem, but the technical capability is there.

 

[muse]

Funds are a problem, but the technical capability is there.

As long as this kind of mentality persists, the problem will persist --
What kind of mentality are you referring to?
The kind which insists that we simply to such a degree that we begin to misrepresent

Funds are not, have never been the problem - funds are like the "golden egg", when you no longer have "golden eggs", the problem is not that you no longer have Golden Eggs", but rather that you do not have the goose that lays "Golden Eggs" - the availability or scarcity of "Funds", is a direct function of the kind of economy you have the Will to produce, it's not some "secret" or "God Given" thing, it's something you must Will into creation --
Oh, boy,here we go, talking about "Will", "Creation" and "Economy" to Pakistines
Yeah, I take your point

 

[satishkumarcsc]

i want to know if a hostile sub is spotted in territorial waters of a country, does that country has the right to sink it?

After a warning...yes. But in Indo-Pak scenario or Sino-Japanese scenario it will lead to escalation. Submariners have a set of rules to follow....if followed then you cant sink them.