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from whose perspective?![]()
Is that even a question? Whose overwhelming perspective is likely to prevail? That is the one that matters, even for Pakistan itself.
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from whose perspective?![]()
ahan, im not even sure i understand what you're trying to imply now - Cheng.
at any rate, Irfan Sahib did say something that's true. There is a path to ''redemption''
on both sides......always remember that trust and partnership are a 2-way thing. Not a 1-way thing, and most certainly not something that is developed over night.
I trust that in the end, Pakistan will be on the right side of history. That's what matters.
The operative words are: ...on Pakistani soil...it helps to at least be informed before making baseless half-truths like that...how many suspects were arrested and handed over to Americans after making positive ID on them.
Fine. Then let US and Karzai deal with them IN AFGHANISTAN. Karzai is our problem. Pakistani soil is Pakistani's problem. Why is that so difficult to understand?you want to talk about trying to control taleban? They are an Afghan phenomenon and currently US/NATO are in Afghanistan. That's your own problem buddy, not ours. You want to talk about grievences now? Under your watchful eye, the indians were setting up ''consulates'' close to our borders. To us that posed a threat, but your side silently nodded and did not even a ''half hearted effort'' to pressure Afghan authorities to shut them down. The Karzai America supported and still supports (without the Americans he's nothing) had a brother who was openly involved in the narcotics industry in Afghanistan. Does this sound healthy to you?
Please...Silence is quite enough protection. Ever heard of 'consent by/through silence' ?to date, US has failed to provide any evidence that OBL was receiving any state protection....even the hawkish Leon Panetta acknoweldged this reality. Without evidence, all you have is your beak.
Bad analogy. Mexican immigrants and drug dealers are not seeking to overthrow the US, nor are they using US as a base to wage a war against anyone else.we are about as competent at enforcing our long and de-marcated border with Afghanistan as you are enforcing your border with Mexico. You have the luxury of liberal, never-ending funding (well as of late, not really). We do not.
We are under no obligations to concede to Omar's offer. After years of negotiations that ended with 9/11, no country would entertain anything less than what we wanted. This is a feeble argument in trying to deflect from Pakistan's responsibility as a sovereign state in controlling sovereign soil.for ''speculations sake'' what do you think would happen in Afghanistan if NATO heeded to Pakistan's advice and didnt attack Afghanistan.....instead they cooperated with the Afghan government and put incredible amount of pressure on them until they gave up the foreign fighters. I believe Mullah Omar had offered to summons OBL to a Shariah-type court and invited the Americans to observe it. Mullah Omar and OBL had a major falling out anyways, so it wasnt like he would be sitting by his feet defending the Yemeni-born Saudi. The Americans insisted on carpet bombing instead, and you are where you are today in Afghanistan because of your own missteps.
Credit? No. Appropriate blame? Yes.you give Pakistan way too much credit for your failures in Afghanistan.
Do not pull this cheap shot on me. I can say the same thing for just about every Pakistanis on this forum.Regarding your posts, I understand where you are coming from because I see this quiet often that some Americans find it very patriotic to only find the faults and put blame on the other side.
It is circular only because you already have the convenience of the failure and/or refusal of Pakistan to control your borders to make it easy for Taliban and al-Qaeda fighters to find refuge and respite in Pakistan, and THAT compounds the difficulties we already have in Afghanistan. The failures we have in Afghanistan -- Pakistan had a hand in facilitating.Having said that, I don’t dismiss your points about our failure to control our borders and use of our soil against the occupation forces in Afghanistan, for every single blame I can quote in kind regarding the writ of the Afghan Government and less than impressive record of occupation forces in Afghanistan but that will only lock us in the circular arguments.
You may not like the contents of the (leaked) report but it is one of many and it is one that is refined and compiled based upon many observations, some valid, some not, of those who have had dealings with the ISI at different levels. Pakistan does not need to control the Taliban, only mutual interests will provide sufficient restraints and guidance as to who can do the most damage to the US presence in Afghanistan and how.But this thread is based on a leak that the Pakistan army/ ISI is actually supporting the Taliban and the impression is that we are madly in love with them. That’s something which we completely dismiss.
if we have even a fraction of control or say over the working of Afghan Taliban as these all fatherless reports claim then the first thing we would have done was self-preservation and safety, by getting the Taliban to eliminate TTP and BLA or deny them the use of Afghan soil.
People who leak these news should make up their mind, are they really serious with the peaceful settlement? Are they wasting time with Taliban meetings in Qatar and Saudi Arabia? The only logical explanation to me is that some American policy makers want to do it alone excluding Pakistan although even that suggestion is absurd and unworkable. And then again there are presidential elections too so that has to be put into context too.