JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[Bratva]

Shaabaash Bhaijan, well done to deflect the thread.

The JF-17 is a great step up for PAF, but it require long legs to step over the height that it has chosen for itself.

Truth does come out, but delaying its exposure allows for wrong preceptions

 

[Argus Panoptes]

Truth does come out, but delaying its exposure allows for wrong decisions

So you agree that the JF-17 program may have trouble meeting the expectations raised so far?

 

[FarazUSA]

Mysteriously, after the crash of JF-17 in 2011, Program suddenly slowed down. 3rd squadron keep getting delayed, no sign of block-2. Block-2 is delayed almost a year.

All the static tests and 200 percent load test on JF-17 was done in mid to late 2012 but these tests were to be wrapped up before July-August 2012 so Block 2 production could start but that didn't happened

Something is definitely wrong behind the scenes.

And it's 1.5 years now after the crash, PAF still hasn't disclosed the probable cause of JF-17 crash which means bird strike theory propogated by usual insiders was a hogwash just like All SAAB's are safe theory was a hogwash.


And in recent interviews JF-17 project director ignored or avoided http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-n...istan-jf-17-fighter-slated-block-2-upgradesto answer why 3rd squadron or Block 2 is kept getting delayed, which shows something is not right

Funding is not an excuse, PAF could have get more loan from China.

China-Pakistan JF-17 Fighter Slated for Block-2 Upgrades | Aviation International News

Take-off Magazine : RD-33: output on the rise

The above two links state 1) Blk2 and Blk3 are being worked on Chinese. 2) Klimov has been working on an improved variant of RD-93 with 9300 kgf on the request of Chinese .

IMHO, engine research can take a few years and going by induction of 20-25 aircraft per year, we would be able to completely induct ~250 aircrafts by ~2020.

 

[Bratva]

So you agree that the JF-17 program may have trouble meeting the expectations raised so far?

That's what you conveyed in your previous post and when asked to explain what you mean, Baat ko gol mol kar dia gaya

 

[Beast]

Funding is not an excuse, PAF could have get more loan from China.

You really think China is sugar daddy? China is not obliged to contribute more money to Pakistan. Anything than that, Pakistan must come up with its hard money.

 

[Argus Panoptes]

That's what you conveyed in your previous post and when asked to explain what you mean, Baat ko gol mol kar dia gaya

No gol mol baat from me Sir. I have already said it very clearly. With the JF-17 program, PAF bit off more than it could chew.

 

[Bratva]

No gol mol baat from me Sir. I have already said it very clearly. With the JF-17 program, PAF bit off more than it could chew.

And my Dear Sir,,,, How is that?

 

[Gentelman]

If the onus of taking decision to choose fighters for PAF lies with me, I would have gone for J-10 instead of investing a penny in Jf-17. J-10 can be termed as a good multi-role fighter. Though PAF will not get J-10B any time in near future, they could have gone with less advanced J-10A and could have license produced it. With each J-10A costing $15 million more than Jf-17, it's ability is more than twice of Jf-17. Jf-17 at present, to me is not good enough to match the present threat perception. I know nothing about blk-2 upgrades, as it has never been officially declared by the concerned authority. Take action to sustain in the future instead of waiting for a program to deliver.


What I mean, IAF is doing same. Tejas still has drag issues which resulting in higher time to accelerate from Mach 1 to Mach 1.5 Higher time to complete a loop,etc. Though it's other features are up to mark, because of drag issue, it can't yet become a reliable point interception fighter. Thus IAF is going for other fighters to fill the gap instead of waiting for it to mature.

What PAF needed was a multirole,home grown,cost effective and medium tech fighter to replace Mairages,A-5s and F-7s thats why JF-17 was slected and it's really impressive fighter and it's range and speed of Upgrades are much more than J-10 series…
and PAF needed light-medium multurole jet while J-10 falls in different category…
speed of uogrades on JFT is indeed impressive as it is using HUD with Digital FBW with HMD and PT-04 achieved speed of mach 2.0 with increase of 0.3 tones payload and also increase in service ceiling so we can expect a great blast in block 2 with Increase in payload,service ceiling,speed,IFR(probably),during flight refuling system and improved radars and avionics………
its AOA is pretty impressive……
I hope that we can see more use of composites on block 2……

 

[Argus Panoptes]

And my Dear Sir,,,, How is that?

Well Sir, that is exactly what we will have to wait for to become evident just how right or wrong that opinion turns out to be or not to be.

 

[SQ8]

I think the correct description may turn out to be this: PAF bit off more than it could chew.

Its not just a problem with the PAF, its the general issue of not having a structured program and skipping steps to meet deadlines and/or cost savings. You may have a sound design, a good blueprint.. but in the end it's your own execution that counts.

 

[Secur]

You want more aircraft and weapons? Don't vote for PPP rats next time.

Do you think we vote at all , friend ?

 

[Argus Panoptes]

Its not just a problem with the PAF, its the general issue of not having a structured program and skipping steps to meet deadlines and/or cost savings. You may have a sound design, a good blueprint.. but in the end it's your own execution that counts.

Managing a project by fits and starts will always lose out to slow and steady planned execution in terms of outcomes. What may have worked for our nuclear program will not work for other projects.

 

[Donatello]

Do you think we vote at all , friend ?

Saeen,

Atleast bhutto is alive!

Its not just a problem with the PAF, its the general issue of not having a structured program and skipping steps to meet deadlines and/or cost savings. You may have a sound design, a good blueprint.. but in the end it's your own execution that counts.

Oscar,

Why do you think there has been a delay in the commission of the 3rd JFT squadron?

Also no news on whether Blk2 has entered production?

 

[SQ8]

Managing a project by fits and starts will always lose out to slow and steady planned execution in terms of outcomes. What may have worked for our nuclear program will not work for other projects.

Its not even fits and starts... It's getting involved in letting certain personalities having too much influence in decision making. Many of these "worshiped" personalities arent worth the safari suit they get made from imported cloth.

 

[Argus Panoptes]

Its not even fits and starts... It's getting involved in letting certain personalities having too much influence in decision making. Many of these "worshiped" personalities arent worth the safari suit they get made from imported cloth.

Unfortunately, I know exactly what you mean, Sir. As always, it is not what you know, but WHO you know that gets you the authority. The lemmings follow.