India spending $3 billion additionally till March to beat China aggression in Ladakh

[arjunk]

Chinese should step up their game. Indians spent $9 billion and 2000 men trying to save their asses from Pakistan in 2002:

2001–2002 India–Pakistan standoff - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mighty Lion]

Taking into account inflation the increase is tiny.

India's general inflation rate was only 5%. Far less than Pakistan's.

Inflation in India 2028 | Statista

The statistic shows the inflation rate in India from 1987 to 2023, with projections up until 2028.

www.statista.com

Also increasing retirement age of frontline troops is a false economy

Again false. Defence pensions have reduced as arrears that were created due to OROP grant were cleared last year

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1356216635154182145

Also just like 2019 and 2020 which saw large emergency purchases crossing even the budgetary limit by large amounts, same thing will happen in 2021 too with the standoff with China on LAC all set to continue

And your own chart proves that how India boosted defence modernization spending by 43% in just 3 yrs.

India's total government budget is $500 billion.

Wrong. This 500 billion is central govt budget. The 28 states have a separate budgets of combined 350 billion (excl. grants they receive from central govt).

Since China is not a federal state, it has only one budget for whole country. India has 29 budgets ( one central budget and 28 state budgets)

 

[Yasser76]

India's general inflation rate was only 5%. Far less than Pakistan's.

Inflation in India 2028 | Statista

The statistic shows the inflation rate in India from 1987 to 2023, with projections up until 2028.

www.statista.com

Again false. Defence pensions have reduced as arrears that were created due to OROP grant were cleared last year

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1356216635154182145

Also just like 2019 and 2020 which saw large emergency purchases crossing even the budgetary limit by large amounts, same thing will happen in 2021 too with the standoff with China on LAC all set to continue

And your own chart proves that how India boosted defence modernization spending by 43% in just 3 yrs.

Wrong. This 500 billion is central govt budget. The 28 states have a separate budgets of combined 350 billion (excl. grants they receive from central govt).

Since China is not a federal state, it has only one budget for whole country. India has 29 budgets ( one central budget and 28 state budgets)

You can read the post? You can read that the defence budget overall decreased and that capital outlay increase was tiny? You can comprehend facts right? So you admit your claim of a big increase in capital outlay was false?

At current budget levels India will STRUGGLE to pay for committed liabilities on purchases.

It is absolutely NOT FALSE that retirement age of army men has increased, your won COAS said this, so you are telling me Indian Army Chief is a liar?

You have lied so much now you are getting yourself in a twist

 

[GS Zhou]

Wrong. This 500 billion is central govt budget. The 28 states have a separate budgets of combined 350 billion (excl. grants they receive from central govt).

Since China is not a federal state, it has only one budget for whole country. India has 29 budgets ( one central budget and 28 state budgets)

What is the total size of the India budget (central + local)? Per my understanding, a big part of the local budget should be the transfer amount from the central. So I want to know the actual scale that such replicates could be avoided.

 

[Mighty Lion]

You can read the post? You can read that the defence budget overall decreased and that capital outlay increase was tiny? You can comprehend facts right? So you admit your claim of a big increase in capital outlay was false?

Wrong.
You are comparing Revised Estimates (RE) of FY20-21 with Budget Estimates (BE) of FY21-22.
What should be compared is BE of FY21-22 with BE of FY20-21 as nobody knows what RE21-22 will be until Feb 2022.

It is absolutely NOT FALSE that retirement age of army men has increased, your won COAS said this, so you are telling me Indian Army Chief is a liar?

General himself said that it was a proposals and such proposals only take affect after it has been approved by Cabinet and so far Cabinet has not approved the proposal. Most such proposals or reccomendations by senior officials are never accepted by Cabinet in the end.

 

[Yasser76]

Wrong.
You are comparing Revised Estimates (RE) of FY20-21 with Budget Estimates (BE) of FY21-22.
What should be compared is BE of FY21-22 with BE of FY20-21 as no knows what RE21-22 will be until Feb 2022.

General himself said that it was a proposals and such proposals only take affect after it has been approved by Cabinet and so far Cabinet has not approved the proposal. Most such proposals or reccomendations by senior officials are never accepted by Cabinet in the end.

Real budget will not be much different from BE, you are simply playing with words. Any idiot can see Indian defence outlays remain largely stagnent.

 

[Mighty Lion]

What is the total size of the India budget (central + local)? Per my understanding, a big part of the local budget should be the transfer amount from the central. So I want to know the actual scale that such replicates could be avoided.

Excluding central grant to states, the 28 states had a budget of around 357 billion last year.

Real budget will not be much different from BE, you are simply playing with words. Any idiot can see Indian defence outlays remain largely stagnent.

Wrong.
Both Revised budgets of 2020-21 and 2019-20 were much higher than the initial defence Budget (mainly in capital outlay).
For example BE20-21 defence capital outlay was 113.7K crores but RE20-21 turned out to be 137K crores.
Capital outlay BE19-20 was 103K crores but RE19-20 became 110K crores.

 

[Yasser76]

Excluding central grant to states, the 28 states had a budget of around 357 billion last year.

Wrong.
Both Revised budgets of 2020-21 and 2019-20 were much higher than the initial defence Budget (mainly in capital outlay).
For example BE20-21 defence capital outlay was 113.7K crores but RE20-21 turned out to be 137K crores.
Capital outlay BE19-20 was 103K crores but RE19-20 became 110K crores.

Yes, but last 12 months saw largest Indian economic decline in 50 years. No way this will than lead to a massive military budget increase, and the one announced yesterday showed that there simply is no money left in the put to cover anything new. Now you are even taking away soldiers pensions to make figures look good

 

[GS Zhou]

Excluding central grant to states, the 28 states had a budget of around 357 billion last year.

Thanks. So the India entire budget (Central + Local) = 430+357= 787 USD billion. That's 40% more than China's budget on education (2020 education budget is RMB 3633.7 billion, or USD 563 billion).

To clarify the resource of the number quoted,
India's central government spending is from the following page

2020 Union budget of India - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

China's government budget 2020 is from the following page:

http://gks.mof.gov.cn/tongjishuju/202101/t20210128_3650522.htm

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

$3B that is a lot of toilet seats that could have been bought..

We are poor country and have to resort to mortgaging our national parks for loans of $3 billion USB

Here another loan scheme from Modi

Mortgaging of New Delhi park planned to get Rs500bn loan

According to reports, due to financial issues the government has decided to mortgage the F-9 park of the federal capital to get a loan of about Rs500bn through issuing bonds.

 

[beijingwalker]

Good to know that China's education budget alone is 1.5x of India's entire budget!

Investment for a nation's future.

 

[Mighty Lion]

Yes, but last 12 months saw largest Indian economic decline in 50 years. No way this will than lead to a massive military budget increase, and the one announced yesterday showed that there simply is no money left in the put to cover anything new. Now you are even taking away soldiers pensions to make figures look good

Given the fact that India overspent defence capital budget by close $3 billion this year even though it is this year (FY20-21) that saw gdp fall and revenue fall.
On the other hand, with both IMF and multiple other orgs predicting that India will grow 9-11.5% in FY21-22, over spending will be far easier in that year

 

[Yasser76]

Given the fact that India overspent defence capital budget by close $3 billion this year even though it is this year (FY20-21) that saw gdp fall and revenue fall.
On the other hand, with both IMF and multiple other orgs predicting that India will grow 9-11.5% in FY21-22, over spending will be far easier in that year

As per source the overspend has to be paid back. You realise how frickin economics work right? If you overspend one year then that money has to be found, that is why legacy payments will take up a large chunk of this years budget, as per the Shukla article, and he knows a damn more about Indian defence than you do.

Finally not a single Indian defence twitter handle is chirping about this budget. Nothing. Silence. It's obvious there is no money in the pot for more Rafales or another carrier.

Of course no one can predict future growth and future budgets may well be larger, but this one shows very small real growth, and with the added sting of cutting pensions and forcing soldiers to serve longer.

 

[achhu]

$3B that is a lot of toilet seats that could have been bought..

haggas can dream only for toilets

We are poor country and have to resort to mortgaging our national parks for loans of $3 billion USB

Here another loan scheme from Modi

Mortgaging of New Delhi park planned to get Rs500bn loan

 

[Mighty Lion]

As per source the overspend has to be paid back.

Actually we have revised our fiscal deficit target upwards by a big amount (6.8% from 4-5% earlier):

India pegs FY22 fiscal deficit at 6.8% | Sunil Kant Munjall to ET NOW

Budget 2021 is being hailed as a reformist budget that has been transparent on the fiscal deficit numbers by announcing a 9.5% fiscal deficit for this financial year. This is higher than earlier estimates and reflects a clean up of sorts of India's balance sheet. Meanwhile this transparency...

www.timesnownews.com

So fiscal displine is now a much lower priority than before.

We have also reduced useless expenditure on things like education and even an agri scheme

School education takes biggest hit: Govt cuts proposed education spending by Rs 6,000 cr

No announcements on recovering learning loss, support for children at risk of not returning to school.

indianexpress.com

Finally not a single Indian defence twitter handle is chirping about this budget. Nothing. Silence. It's obvious there is no money in the pot for more Rafales or another carrier.

The biggest and mightiest of all Indian defence twitter account (@rajnathsingh) is harping about near 20% increase in capital budget.
Even Ex Army chief is praising it

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1356188258024136704