Hellenic Navy: Construction of the second FDI HN frigate begins.

[Akritas]

So Naval Group might have the ECM ready by 2025,huh?

Obviously, the Greek Navy will have the last word, However, the project is being worked on, from all sides (Hellenic Navy, Thales, Leonardo and of course Naval)

 

[Foinikas]

If Thales and Naval Group can make one until 2025,that would be great though. Still,the Navy knows better,like Ptisi always says.

 

[MMM-E]

Sad to see Greece spending billions on useless toys it does not need.

YES , as You said full of waste money ... 3 FDI Frigates can not change anything

Greece should work with Turkiye instead of dreaming about fighting


If Greece buys 3 FDI Frigates , then

-- Turkiye produce 31 new Warships

-- 150 km CAKIR and 250 km ATMACA Coastal Defense Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion

-- even Turkiye can send 10 unmanned Vessels armed with total of 80 CAKIR anti-ship Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion

-- even Turkiye can send 10 AKINCI UCAVs armed with total of 90 KUZGUN--TJ Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion

Even I am not talking about Turkish F-16s armed with 280 km SOM and SLAM-ER anti-ship missiles and 14 hunter killler Submarines of the Turkish Navy


How to match with the Turkish Navy ? never

Hellenic Navy 3 FDI Frigates in 2025-2026

32 x ASTER SAMs
21 x RAM
8 x EXOCET anti-ship Missiles


Turkish Navy 4 ISTIF and 4 MEKO-200TM Frigates in 2025-2026

-- 64 x ESSM SAMs ..... ( 8 x SIPER + 32 x HISAR-RF SAMs )
-- KORKUT 35mm CIWS .... ( PHALANX 20 mm CIWS + KORKUT 35mm CIWS )
-- 16 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles

 

[Akritas]

Dont spamming and this thread with your BS.

 

[MMM-E]

Dont spamming and this thread with your BS.

You both Foinikas and Akritas always spammed my threads with your BS

 

[Foinikas]

YES , as You said full of waste money ... 3 FDI Frigates can not change anything

Greece should work with Turkiye instead of dreaming about fighting


If Greece buys 3 FDI Frigates , then

-- Turkiye produce 31 new Warships

-- 150 km CAKIR and 250 km ATMACA Coastal Defense Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion

-- even Turkiye can send 10 unmanned Vessels armed with total of 80 CAKIR anti-ship Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion

-- even Turkiye can send 10 AKINCI UCAVs armed with total of 90 KUZGUN--TJ Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion

Even I am not talking about Turkish F-16s armed with 280 km SOM and SLAM-ER anti-ship missiles and 14 hunter killler Submarines of the Turkish Navy


How to match with the Turkish Navy ? never

Hellenic Navy 3 FDI Frigates in 2025-2026

32 x ASTER SAMs
21 x RAM
8 x EXOCET anti-ship Missiles


Turkish Navy 4 ISTIF and 4 MEKO-200TM Frigates in 2025-2026

-- 64 x ESSM SAMs ..... ( 8 x SIPER + 32 x HISAR-RF SAMs )
-- KORKUT 35mm CIWS .... ( PHALANX 20 mm CIWS + KORKUT 35mm CIWS )
-- 16 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles

View attachment 873398

First of all,we're not only buying 3 FDI HN frigates,we're also buying new corvettes and trying to modernize 2 or all 4 of the MEKO 200HN. Apart from that,the deal with the corvettes might include more ships. Depending on the deal of course.

Second,you assume that your future projects will be definetely built,while your economy has been at its worst point and you might be getting new sanctions from USA and others because of the new S-400 batch,combined with your stance on the Sweden and Finland matter and your dealings with Putin.

Third,you continue to think that naval warfare is about having the most AA missiles. You ignore the countermeasures,the chaff,the failures and of course the experience of the crews. You've been comparing AA stocks in your posts,as if having the most will make someone the winner. I can tell you,that's not always how you win a naval battle. And naval battles in the Yom Kippur War,Iran-Iraq War,Falklands and elsewhere have shown that's not the case.

 

[MMM-E]

First of all,we're not only buying 3 FDI HN frigates,we're also buying new corvettes and trying to modernize 2 or all 4 of the MEKO 200HN. Apart from that,the deal with the corvettes might include more ships. Depending on the deal of course.

Still so weak to compare with the Turkish Navy


1-- Turkish Navy has already 4 ADA class Corvettes

2-- if Greece modernize 2 MEKO 200HN Frigates . then Turkiye modernize 4 MEKO-200TN Frigates with superior fire power and technology

3-- if Greece buys 3 FDI Frigates then Turkiye produce 31 new Warships

4 ISTIF class Frigates
7 TF-2000 class Destroyers
10 HISAR class OPVs ( 8x HISAR SAMs and 8 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles )
10 new FACs ( 21x RAM and 8 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles )

and Dozens of unmanned Vessels armed with 8 x CAKIR anti-ship Missiles

 

[MMM-E]

Second,you assume that your future projects will be definetely built,while your economy has been at its worst point and you might be getting new sanctions from USA and others because of the new S-400 batch,combined with your stance on the Sweden and Finland matter and your dealings with Putin.

Our Economy is bigger than Greece+Egypt combined and no any failed military project


and nice dream but sanctions from USA , ITALY , etc can not stop Turkish Naval projects


because Turkiye has developed all systems , missiles for Turkish Naval projects

Turkiye is 3rd country in NATO with USA and France that designe , produce Corvette , Frigate , Destroyer with indigenous Radars , Systems and Missiles

We dont need İtalian Naval gun anymore
We dont need American CIWS anymore
We dont need American VLS anymore
We dont need American Combat Management System anymore
We dont need American anti-ship Missile anymore
We dont need American Surface to Air Missile anymore
We dont need American Torpedos anymore
We dont need American EW Systems anymore
We dont need American Sonar anymore
We dont need Radars anymore

 

[Foinikas]

1-- Turkish Navy has already 4 ADA class Corvettes

ADA class corvettes are already inadequate against our navy. They would be inferior to our new ships.

3-- if Greece buys 3 FDI Frigates then Turkiye produce 31 new Warships

That's a lot of ifs there,buddy. If Turkey produces 31 Warships,then we'll see. For the time being,these are just dreams. 31 new warships are a big deal for a country with about 200% inflation and under the threat of heavy sanctions by the US and EU.

We dont need İtalian Naval gun anymore
We dont need American CIWS anymore
We dont need American VLS anymore
We dont need American Combat Management System anymore
We dont need American anti-ship Missile anymore
We dont need American Surface to Air Missile anymore
We dont need American Torpedos anymore
We dont need American EW Systems anymore
We dont need American Sonar anymore
We dont need Radars anymore

Yes,you've posted this before and you're just c/p again now.

You might not need all that,but you might still need money,a population that would be content and materials. Lots of materials. Heavy sanctions and embargo on certain things,would cripple your ability to produce even half of that stuff.
Remember,the Germans in WWII had their own production,but after they lost access to supplies,all their production capabilities were useless.

 

[MMM-E]

Third,you continue to think that naval warfare is about having the most AA missiles. You ignore the countermeasures,the chaff,the failures and of course the experience of the crews. You've been comparing AA stocks in your posts,as if having the most will make someone the winner. I can tell you,that's not always how you win a naval battle. And naval battles in the Yom Kippur War,Iran-Iraq War,Falklands and elsewhere have shown that's not the case.

Still you dont understand what about war and fire power

Even in 1915 , Turks destroyed most modern British and French Warships with artillery systems

today Turkiye has everything and the strongest missile fire power in NATO after USA


FDI Frigate armed with only 53 SAMs ( 32 ASTER and 21 RAM ) which can not stop swarm attack of 90 CAKIR - KUZGUN-TJ - SOM Missiles

even I am not talking about hundreds of HARPOON , HARM , SLAM-ER , TRLG-230 Missiles

Turkiye is not buying , but producing missiles


even No need naval war
Turkiye easly can destroy 3 FDI Frigates with only land - air launched Missiles

 

[Foinikas]

Even in 1915 , Turks destroyed most modern British and French Warships with artillery systems

And from 1912 to 1913 we had smashed your fleet and you didn't dare go out in the Aegean until WWI,when the British shut you back in the sea of Marmara and beyond.

You still use examples from a century ago. You're running out of arguements.

FDI Frigate armed with only 53 SAMs ( 32 ASTER and 21 RAM ) which can not stop swarm attack of 90 CAKIR - KUZGUN-TJ - SOM Missiles

You still talk about SAMs. You still think that only SAMs play a role on the battlefield. There are many ways to deter such attacks. There are EW and ECM measures,there are pre-emptive attacks,there are conventional counter-measures and of course the question of the quality of these so-called indigenous Turkish weapons. If you think our Navy is not looking for strategies against swarm attacks and new Turkish threats,you're wrong. You underestimate us.

Turkiye is not buying , but producing missiles

Again,you ignored what I talked about in the previous post. You didn't even pay attention to what I said about economy,heavy sanctions and embargo.

 

[MMM-E]

ADA class corvettes are already inadequate against our navy. They would be inferior to our new ships.

as of 2022 Hellenic Navy ELLI class Frigates are so inferior to our ADA class Corvettes

ELLI class Frigate : 16 x RIM-7 SAMs and 8 x HARPOON anti-ship Missiles
ADA class Corvette : 21 x RIM-116 SAMs and 8 x HARPOON anti-ship Missiles


ADA class Corvettes also to hunt Submarines
These highly stealthy Ships have extremely reduced radar, IR and acoustic signatures, and they are backed by a low probability of intercept (LPI) radar that could sneak up to enemy surface vessels and deliver a lethal blow

That's a lot of ifs there,buddy. If Turkey produces 31 Warships,then we'll see. For the time being,these are just dreams. 31 new warships are a big deal for a country with about 200% inflation and under the threat of heavy sanctions by the US and EU.

Still dreaming about sanctions ....


Turkiye spend even $66 billion to buy 387 new Planes for Turkish Airlines
Turkiye has enough money

not only 31 new Warships , but also

2 Light Aircraft Carriers ( TCG ANADOLU and TCG TRAKYA )
4 BAYRAKTAR class LST
1 Electronic Warfare Ship ( TCG UFUK )
1 Fleet Tanker ( TCG DERYA )
6 Type-214TN AIP Submarines

And from 1912 to 1913 we had smashed your fleet and you didn't dare go out in the Aegean until WWI,when the British shut you back in the sea of Marmara and beyond.

Ottoman Navy was destroyed by UK+France+Russia in 1827

in 1912 - 1913 , We had no Navy except a few outdated Vessels
and in 1915 , Turks destroyed most modern British and French Warships with artillery systems ( because , We had no Navy in 1915 )

today Turkiye has everything and the strongest missile fire power in NATO after USA
and Turkish Navy is strongest Navy in the region

as of 2022 , Hellenic Navy is so weak and incapable
3 FDI Frigates can not change anything

 

[Foinikas]

as of 2022 Hellenic Navy ELLI class Frigates are so inferior to our ADA class Corvettes

ELLI class Frigate : 16 x RIM-7 SAMs and 8 x HARPOON anti-ship Missiles
ADA class Corvette : 21 x RIM-116 SAMs and 8 x HARPOON anti-ship Missiles


ADA class Corvettes also to hunt Submarines
These highly stealthy Ships have extremely reduced radar, IR and acoustic signatures, and they are backed by a low probability of intercept (LPI) radar that could sneak up to enemy surface vessels and deliver a lethal blow

@Akritas tell him about why Ada class are not as great as he thinks

But since he insists on AA defence...

Ada Class:

Elli Class:

Turkiye spend even $66 billion to buy 387 new Planes for Turkish Airlines
Turkiye has enough money

not only 31 new Warships , but also

2 Light Aircraft Carriers ( TCG ANADOLU and TCG TRAKYA )
4 BAYRAKTAR class LST
1 Electronic Warfare Ship ( TCG UFUK )
1 Fleet Tanker ( TCG DERYA )
6 Type-21TN AIP Submarines

And you don't see anything ridiculous about all that when you have 200% unofficial inflation??

 

[MMM-E]

You still talk about SAMs. You still think that only SAMs play a role on the battlefield. There are many ways to deter such attacks. There are EW and ECM measures,there are pre-emptive attacks,there are conventional counter-measures and of course the question of the quality of these so-called indigenous Turkish weapons. If you think our Navy is not looking for strategies against swarm attacks and new Turkish threats,you're wrong. You underestimate us.

So funny , You should learn about military

EW and ECM measures are against only anti-ship Missiles with active radar homing like French EXOCET , American HARPOON

but Turkish SOM , ATMACA-K , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ use IIR seeker
and EW and ECM measures can not do anything against IIR guided Missiles



FDI Frigate never can stop swarm attack of 90 Turkish Missiles

1 FDI Frigate : $1 billion
90 CAKIR or KUZGUN-TJ Missiles : max $30 million

 

[MMM-E]

@Akritas tell him about why Ada class are not as great as he thinks

But since he insists on AA defence...

Ada Class:

View attachment 873534

Elli Class:

View attachment 873535


And you don't see anything ridiculous about all that when you have 200% unofficial inflation??

ADA class has 21 x RAM to counter 8 x anti-ships missiles on Greek Frigates

ADA class Corvettes are stealthy and have extremely reduced radar, IR and acoustic signatures, and they are backed by a low probability of intercept (LPI) radar that could sneak up to enemy surface vessels and deliver a lethal blow


ELLI and HYDRA class Frigates armed with only 16 x SAMs .. so weak

GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 SM-1MR and 32 ESSM SAMs
MEKO 200 Track-IIB Frigates armed with 64 x ESSM - RIM-7 SAMs





as of 2022 , Hellenic Navy is so weak and incapable

Hellenic Navy has 13 Frigates armed with only 208 SAMs

9 ELLI class Frigates armed with only 16 x RIM-7 SAMs
4 HYDRA class Frigates armed with only 16 x ESSM SAMs

what a inferior fire power and poor self defence capability



Turkish Navy has 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs

4 GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 SM-1MR SAMs
4 GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 SM-1MR and 32 ESSM SAMs
4 MEKO-200 Track-IIA Frigates armed with 16 x RIM-7 SAMs
2 MEKO 200 Track-IIB Frigates armed with 32 x ESSM SAMs
2 MEKO 200 Track-IIB Frigates armed with 64 x ESSM - RIM-7 SAMs


Turkish Navy has more SAMs than Hellenic+French Navies combined