Air Battle: What If an F-14 (That Iran Still Flies) Battled a Stealth F-22 Raptor?

[Persian Gulf 1906]

Interesting. What proof did you provide for the killing of Iranian Diplomats when you massed your troops against the Talibanis? Where was this rationale when you actually bombed the territory? So, did you 'prove' your case?

The diplomats were killed in Afghanistan, that is proof in itself, quite different to attacks on US Embassies abroad.

Massing troops on the border ≠ launching 70+ cruise missiles into Afghanistan and killing several Afghan citizens.

Dumb comment.

So, OBL was in Pakistan when US invaded Afghanistan? Can you cite references for that? Because, to the contrary, lot of material exists.

I didn't say he was in Pakistan when the US invaded Afghanistan, no one knows where he was (the mighty CIA certainly were utterly clueless), but he was found in Pakistan in broad daylight in a massive complex.

Can you provide proof?

Yes. But this isn't a legal trial, so you can go do your own research instead of trying to look educated shilling for the US.

What make you think we need to 'invade' in order to render your military as impotent as a guy with ED?

When your air bases cannot launch because of cratered runways and destroyed hangars, what can you do?

Our airforce is already impotent, clearly you have no idea about Iran's defence strategy.

Typical ignorant and arrogant 'Murican.

 

[gambit]

Our airforce is already impotent,...

Then so WILL the rest of your military.

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

Then so WILL the rest of your military.

So will the rest of our military... what?

I thought Americans spoke English, more fool me!

How you've amassed +128 green ratings is quite astonishing given your clear ignorance of Iran's military doctrine, brazen chauvinism and childish attitude.

 

[Hellfire]

The diplomats were killed in Afghanistan, that is proof in itself, quite different to attacks on US Embassies abroad.

So, your logic was, killed in Afghanistan, so killed by Afghanis. How was US logic different then? USS Cole was claimed by AQ, based out of Afghanistan.

Massing troops on the border ≠ launching 70+ cruise missiles into Afghanistan and killing several Afghan citizens.

It would be dumb comment if your intent was merely posturing. You shelled Afghanistan. You would have gone in, but honestly, you were not in a position to fight then, you are not in a position to fight now.

It may look 'dumb' to you..... but you do not have the economic capacity to sustain cruise missile attacks on Afghanistan .... even US depleted it's stocks, if reports in public domain are to be believed, in the same. And their economic capability is in a class by itself.

I didn't say he was in Pakistan when the US invaded Afghanistan, no one knows where he was (the mighty CIA certainly were utterly clueless), but he was found in Pakistan in broad daylight in a massive complex.

I quoted you for exactly what you statement said. Inference was a result of your sentences. So, you were incorrect in forming your sentence to communicate what you actually meant?

Anyways.He moved to Afghanistan as Northern Alliance moved to consolidate their hold. Every one and their dog knew.

Yes. But this isn't a legal trial, so you can go do your own research instead of trying to look educated shilling for the US.

Precisely. So do not make (un)educated 'illegal invasion' posts then. You were merely engaged on making a pretty dumb statement on a defence forum.

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

So, your logic was, killed in Afghanistan, so killed by Afghanis. How was US logic different then? USS Cole was claimed by AQ, based out of Afghanistan.

USS Cole has nothing to do with the 1998 Operation Infinite Reach which was a response to US Embassies in AFRICA being attacked.

Jesus Christ.

It may look 'dumb' to you..... but you do not have the economic capacity to sustain cruise missile attacks on Afghanistan .... even US depleted it's stocks, if reports in public domain are to be believed, in the same. And their economic capability is in a class by itself.

What is your point? I didn't say Iran had the economic capacity to do anything, so I don't know why you're blabbering on about this nonsense.

Precisely. So do not make (un)educated 'illegal invasion' posts then. You were merely engaged on making a pretty dumb statement on a defence forum.

More nonsense.

I think we're done here.

 

[Hellfire]

@Persian Gulf 1906

You have a right to your view, no two views on that. Iran is a nation we consider as friendly. Hence, what I am engaging you on, is your right not to misrepresent Iranian interests arising out of inadequacy of knowledge/understanding. I am merely challenging your posts because I am defending a friendly nation.

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

@Persian Gulf 1906

You have a right to your view, no two views on that. Iran is a nation we consider as friendly. Hence, what I am engaging you on, is your right not to misrepresent Iranian interests arising out of inadequacy of knowledge/understanding. I am merely challenging your posts because I am defending a friendly nation.

Everyone and his dog knows that the US invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan (etc) were illegal and that the US is the biggest war criminal state in modern history.

The only person misrepresenting was you rebutting straw man arguments about Iran's ability to launch cruise missiles at Afghanistan, unfortunately for you I clearly exposed those for everyone to see.

Good day.

 

[Hellfire]

USS Cole has nothing to do with the 1998 Operation Infinite Reach which was a response to US Embassies in AFRICA being attacked.

Jesus Christ.

So, only embassy bombing was the reason. A single act made US go to war? Or was it a culmination of numerous actions which seem unrelated but allowed US to act against them simultaneously?

What is your point? I didn't say Iran had the economic capacity to do anything, so I don't know why you're blabbering on about this nonsense.

Point is precisely that. The word as bold, needs to be stopped at your end. Using cruise missiles is not correct, shelling by artillery is correct. Using chemical defoliants is chemical warfare, using mustard gas in Iran-Iraq war was not.

What yardstick is applicable to you, is applicable to others. And reverse. Stop with your rhetoric already, please.

Everyone and his dog knows that the US invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan (etc) were illegal and that the US is the biggest war criminal state in modern history.

The only person misrepresenting was you rebutting straw man arguments about Iran's ability to launch cruise missiles at Afghanistan, unfortunately for you I clearly exposed those for everyone to see.

Good day.

LOL!

Wonder who was exposed for what?

Good day to you too.

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

So, only embassy bombing was the reason. A single act made US go to war? Or was it a culmination of numerous actions which seem unrelated but allowed US to act against them simultaneously?

Clearly you have got your little brain into quite a pickle.

I was referring exclusively to Operation Infinite Reach in 1998 which was a response to the bombings of US Embassies in Africa.

The US didn't go to war in Afghanistan until after the 9/11 attacks (which were after 1998).

This first history lesson is for free.

Using chemical defoliants is chemical warfare, using mustard gas in Iran-Iraq war was not.

Who used mustard gas in Iran-Iraq war you little retard? SADDAM used mustard gas against IRANIANS with US support, don't talk about things you clearly don't know anything about (which appears to be most things).

 

[Signalian]

Q: What If an F-14 (That Iran Still Flies) Battled a Stealth F-22 Raptor?

The F-14 would be dead without the aircrew knowing they were targeted.

Simple as that.

RwR won't get triggered when the lock is on ?

 

[Avicenna]

Raptor could foreseeably get into within sidewinder range without being detected I would assume.

Tomcat wouldn’t know what hit them.

 

[gambit]

So will the rest of our military... what?

That without the air force, the rest of your military is essentially impotent.

I thought Americans spoke English, more fool me!

Considering how you missed what I said, yes, you are the fool.

How you've amassed +128 green ratings is quite astonishing given your clear ignorance of Iran's military doctrine, brazen chauvinism and childish attitude.

And what make you think you have any credible knowledge of US military? The fact that you brought on an invasion means it is YOU who are ignorant of military affairs.

An invasion is necessary for certain military objectives, but not all. What we wanted for Iraq does not mean we want the same for Iran. So if all we want is to render the ENTIRE Iranian military impotent, US airpower will do.

RwR won't get triggered when the lock is on ?

The F-22's radar will be in LPI operation.

LPI = Low Probability of Intercept. The word 'intercept' meant to be detected, as in the target found out it is being scanned.

LPI operation is not easy. It is both hardware and software dependent. Let us say a typical scan operation is one second duration and at 100 watt. We are using easy figures for simplicity here. What LPI -- hardware and software -- does is to spread that energy over different freqs at the same one second duration. The spread covers both amplitude and freq agility (hopping). The result is that for the radar warning receiver (RWR) set, sometimes it detects a spike, sometimes it does not. The inconsistency is so persistent that the RWR system have no choice but to dismiss those signals as nothing more than background aberrations.

 

[Nilgiri]

The F-22's radar will be in LPI operation.

LPI = Low Probability of Intercept. The word 'intercept' meant to be detected, as in the target found out it is being scanned.

LPI operation is not easy. It is both hardware and software dependent. Let us say a typical scan operation is one second duration and at 100 watt. We are using easy figures for simplicity here. What LPI -- hardware and software -- does is to spread that energy over different freqs at the same one second duration. The spread covers both amplitude and freq agility (hopping). The result is that for the radar warning receiver (RWR) set, sometimes it detects a spike, sometimes it does not. The inconsistency is so persistent that the RWR system have no choice but to dismiss those signals as nothing more than background aberrations.

Little bits that get through the forum past all its "background aberrations", make it all worth it in the end. Thanks!

 

[Hellfire]

Clearly you have got your little brain into quite a pickle.

I was referring exclusively to Operation Infinite Reach in 1998 which was a response to the bombings of US Embassies in Africa.

Oh, the parameters change?

The US didn't go to war in Afghanistan until after the 9/11 attacks (which were after 1998).

This first history lesson is for free.

Like I said, am yet to see a day when a single incident results in a military conflict rather than a sequence of events that seem unrelated.

Maybe you should pay for your lessons of history, especially military history.

Who used mustard gas in Iran-Iraq war you little retard? SADDAM used mustard gas against IRANIANS with US support, don't talk about things you clearly don't know anything about (which appears to be most things).

Like I said, pay for your lessons, you may show your ineptitude a little less,

Iran - used limited chemical strikes in Basrah against Iraqi Army III Corps tasked with defence there in April 1987 and mustard gas in 2nd week of October 1987, in response to Iraqi attacks.

I am not saying you initiated it. I am saying, do not paint a picture of self righteous indignation

Again, it was your inability to field either chemical weapons in adequate quantities or adequate number of IPEs that is exhibited, not your moral uprightness. Whenever Iran captured chemical weapons, it used them on Iraqis back (I have not qualms on this, it needs to be done if you are being attacked first).


To quote you,

Clearly you have got your little brain into quite a pickle.

PS: Who gave you the stock of Thionyl Chloride? Who gave you the first few instructors to raise your Chemical Protection elements? Research that and then talk.

At least do not teach me about your chemical weapons program.

RwR won't get triggered when the lock is on ?

Logic!

 

[LeGenD]

That arrogance cost the lives of thousands of American soldiers in countless illegal American invasions over the last 50 years.

Most of the casualties were on the ground, and due to enemy switching to asymmetric methods of warfare. The manner in which Muslims choose to fight these days, is utterly cowardly and in stark contrast to the principles of Battle of Badr.

Anyways, US will steamroll Iran in a "conventional war." Their is no shame in admitting this, because this is situation of majority vis-a-vis US.

The US wasted $6 trillion+ of taxpayer money in their useless invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan post-9/11 attacks, two countries that had nothing to do with the 9/11 attacks whilst 15 of the 19 terrorists were Saudi citizens (as was the mastermind - OBL).

Your claims are completely off the mark (and charts).

Costs of these expeditions are high due to massive logistics requirements of a sophisticated war-machine (stretching all the way from US mainland to the battlefields), and due to push for political reforms in Iraq and Afghanistan respectively.

Total cost of operations, and rebuilding efforts, in Iraq = 1.1 Trillion USD mark (2003 - 2018)
Total cost of operations, and rebuilding efforts, in Afghanistan = 1.1 Trillion USD mark (2001 - 2018)

Al-Qaeda Network was responsible for 9/11 event, and its base of operations was in Afghanistan at the time (with legs in Pakistan; unfortunately). US invaded Afghanistan to eradicate this regime from Afghanistan (and Pakistan), and fulfilled this objective by 2011.

Al-Qaeda Network was a multi-national regime, and recruited individuals from all over the world. Why should KSA be held accountable for 9/11 event due to nationality of individuals involved? KSA did not allow Al-Qaeda Network to establish its base of operations in Saudi territory, but Afghanistan (under Afghan Taliban) did.

Afghan Taliban, in its current form, have unanimously decided that it will NOT repeat mistakes of Mullah Omar, and Pakistan have also adopted a strong anti-terrorist drive in current times. US have driven the message home in this part of the world, if you ask me.

Question is; have Iran learned any lesson or not?

I admit that US should not have victimized Iraq; this expedition was completely unnecessary and had no justification. On the bright side, Saddam Hussein, and his Ba'ath party, are HISTORY, and Iraq seems to have embraced democratic reforms which would be good for its masses in the long-term (Shia; Sunni; Kurd - each have a say in Iraqi affairs now).

On the flip side, these expeditions created jobs for many, American Military Industrial Complex flourished, and US have secured many lucrative deals. COSTS and BENEFITS - both should be accounted for in an assessment.