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A muslim sister from Virginia, USA embrace martyrdom in this holly month of Ramadan.

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Hate groups nearly tripled from 34 to 101 in 2016, according to a report by the Southern Poverty Law Center.
I was responding to someone who claimed someting about US crime statistics. You won't take this thread off topic please.

Nothing qualifies murder and nor should it be justified. Otherwise you make room for glamourising murder and that is inexcusable.
Someone please tell this to the blokes that are causing problems in various places in Europe ... in the name of IS.
 
I was responding to someone who claimed someting about US crime statistics. You won't take this thread off topic please.

Providing US statistics on a US hate crime related to a US incident isn't going off topic.

I was responding to someone who claimed someting about US crime statistics. You won't take this thread off topic please.


Someone please tell this to the blokes that are causing problems in various places in Europe ... in the name of IS.

Any EU incident is condemned, just recently a Finsbury White Supermacist radicalised by a White Supermacist racial party ploughed into civilians coming out off a Mosque after worship. It was and is treated as a Terrorist attack.
 
Western countries have a huge problem with addressing hate crimes and terrorist attacks. Even though I'm a libtard personally I feel that the idea of free speech is flawed, because then no line is drawn and therefore nothing qualifies as hate speech. There is also s massive bias towards to crimes done by Muslims and say someone of white ethnicity. The former will always be labeled as a terrorist attack while the latter is always "a mentally disturbed lone shooter and it has nothing to do with his beliefs" . I see how its easy to associate relugious terrorism to Muslims but half of the time there is no religious motive. Do you think the dude was thinking "oh look I just killed their children they will convert to Islam now"
 
Fact is she was heading to a Mosque with a group of friends, it's Ramadhan - Taraveeh roughly finish around 1/2am. And Suhoor many wish to head at local Masjid or increase their worship specifically in the last 10 days. This takes you the time of 3/4am - Fajr.

I've done it before it's a normal trend in Ramadhan and nothing out of the ordinary. Therefore doesn't make it justifiable or excusable.
From the Washington Post article:
"was assaulted and then disappeared after leaving a mosque in the Sterling area"
"According to accounts from police and a mosque official, a group of four or five teens were walking back from breakfast at IHOP early Sunday when they were confronted by a motorist. All but one of the teens ran to the mosque, where the group reported that the girl had been left behind,"
"Remains thought to be the girl’s were found about 3 p.m."
"Shoyeb Hassan, the co-chair of ADAMS, said that during the last 10 days of Ramadan, the mosque has extra prayers at midnight and 2 a.m., and members frequently go to McDonald’s or the 24-hour IHOP to eat before they start their fast at sunrise, as Nabra and her friends were doing."
"evening prayers, which ended about 12:30 a.m. Sunday. As they were pulling out of the parking lot, he said, he saw a group of teenagers congregating and talking loudly about going out to eat. The girls, he said, were wearing the abaya, a full-length dress many Muslim women wear."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...d706461fa4f_story.html?utm_term=.736e3975c2d6

So, IMHO, they came from the midnight prayers, ate and either a) were going back to attend the 2 am prayers, or b) were done with evening prayers and would be going home after eating but then fled back to the mosque.

Nabra’s mother, Sawsan Gazzar, said she thought Nabra and her friends would eat at the mosque after the prayers, and she would have forbidden her from walking to IHOP in the middle of the night. But she also wasn’t surprised that the girl went out; she and other teens had done it safely last year.

Providing US statistics on a US hate crime related to a US incident isn't going off topic.
There was nothing in my post that addressed the crime statistics issue and that was directed at another member, to warrent you quoting me to post statistics on hate crime in the US. Please do not take the thread off topic.

Hate Crime Statistics
Data regarding crimes motivated by bias against race/ethnicity/ancestry, gender and gender identity, religion, disability, or sexual orientation, including those committed by or directed toward juveniles

You are now leaving the Federal Bureau of Investigation WWW system.

The FBI takes no responsibility for, and exercises no control over, the organizations, views, accuracy, copyright or trademark compliance or legality of the material contained on this server.

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You are about to access: /hate-crime/2015/home
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2015/crime-in-the-u.s.-2015/hate-crime-statistics

Overview
  • In 2015, 14,997 law enforcement agencies participated in the Hate Crime Statistics Program. Of these agencies, 1,742 reported 5,850 hate crime incidents involving 6,885 offenses. (See Tables 1 and 12.)
  • There were 5,818 single-bias incidents that involved 6,837 offenses, 7,121 victims, and 5,475 known offenders. (See Table 1.)
  • The 32 multiple-bias incidents reported in 2015 involved 48 offenses, 52 victims, and 18 known offenders. (See Table 1.)
Single-bias incidents (Based on Table 1.)
Analysis of the 5,818 single-bias incidents reported in 2015 revealed that:
  • 56.9 percent were motivated by a race/ethnicity/ancestry bias.
  • 21.4 percent were prompted by religious bias.
  • 18.1 percent resulted from sexual-orientation bias.
  • 2.0 percent were motivated by gender-identity bias.
  • 1.3 percent were prompted by disability bias.
  • 0.4 percent (23 incidents) were motivated by a gender bias.
Offenses by bias motivation within incidents (Based on Table 1.)
Of the 6,837 single-bias hate crime offenses reported in the above incidents:
  • 58.9 percent stemmed from a race/ethnicity/ancestry bias.
  • 19.8 percent were motivated by religious bias.
  • 17.8 percent resulted from sexual-orientation bias.
  • 1.7 percent stemmed from gender-identity bias.
  • 1.3 percent resulted from bias against disabilities.
  • 0.4 percent (29 offenses) were prompted by gender bias.
Race/Ethnicity/Ancestry bias (Based on Table 1.)
In 2015, law enforcement agencies reported that 4,029 single-bias hate crime offenses were motivated by race/ethnicity/ancestry. Of these offenses:
  • 52.7 percent were motivated by anti-Black or African American bias.
  • 18.2 percent stemmed from anti-White bias.
  • 9.4 percent were classified as anti-Hispanic or Latino bias.
  • 3.4 percent were motivated by anti-American Indian or Alaska Native bias.
  • 3.4 percent were a result of bias against groups of individuals consisting of more than one race (anti-multiple races, group).
  • 3.3 percent resulted from anti-Asian bias.
  • 1.2 percent were classified as anti-Arab bias.
  • 0.1 percent (6 offenses) were motivated by bias of anti-Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander.
  • 8.2 percent were the result of an anti-other Race/Ethnicity/Ancestry bias.
Religious bias (Based on Table 1.)
Hate crimes motivated by religious bias accounted for 1,354 offenses reported by law enforcement. A breakdown of the bias motivation of religious-biased offenses showed:
  • 51.3 percent were anti-Jewish.
  • 22.2 percent were anti-Islamic (Muslim).
  • 4.4 percent were anti-Catholic.
  • 4.2 percent were anti-multiple religions, group.
  • 3.7 percent were Anti-Eastern Orthodox (Russian, Greek, Other).
  • 3.5 percent were anti-Protestant.
  • 1.3 percent were anti-Other Christian.
  • 0.6 percent were Anti-Mormon
  • 0.4 percent (6 offenses) were Anti-Sikh.
  • 0.4 percent (5 offenses) were Anti-Hindu.
  • 0.1 percent (2 offenses) were anti-Atheism/Agnosticism/etc.
  • 0.1 percent (1 offense) were Anti-Buddhist.
  • 0.1 percent (1 offense) were Anti-Jehovah’s Witness.
  • 7.7 percent were anti-other (unspecified) religion.
Source https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2015/home
For other years (to establish trends) https://ucr.fbi.gov/ucr-publications#Hate
e.g. 2014 https://ucr.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/hate-crime/2014/topic-pages/incidentsandoffenses_final

With this, consider these US demographics

Ethnic groups
By race:

77.1% White
13.3% Black
2.6% Other/multiracial
5.6% Asian
1.2% Native
0.2% Pacific Islander
Ethnicity:
17.6% Hispanic or Latino
82.4% non-Hispanic or Latino

Religion
70.6% Christian
1.9% Jewish
0.9% Muslim
0.7% Buddhist
0.7% Hindu
1.8% Other faiths
22.8% Irreligious

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States

Let's see
  • 51.3 percent were anti-Jewish. | 1.9% Jewish
  • 22.2 percent were anti-Islamic (Muslim). | 0.9% Muslim

2.1x as many jews as muslims in the US
2.3x as many anti-jew offences as anti-muslim offences.

Not a huge difference imho.
 
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From the Washington Post article:
"was assaulted and then disappeared after leaving a mosque in the Sterling area"
"According to accounts from police and a mosque official, a group of four or five teens were walking back from breakfast at IHOP early Sunday when they were confronted by a motorist. All but one of the teens ran to the mosque, where the group reported that the girl had been left behind,"
"Remains thought to be the girl’s were found about 3 p.m."
"Shoyeb Hassan, the co-chair of ADAMS, said that during the last 10 days of Ramadan, the mosque has extra prayers at midnight and 2 a.m., and members frequently go to McDonald’s or the 24-hour IHOP to eat before they start their fast at sunrise, as Nabra and her friends were doing."
"evening prayers, which ended about 12:30 a.m. Sunday. As they were pulling out of the parking lot, he said, he saw a group of teenagers congregating and talking loudly about going out to eat. The girls, he said, were wearing the abaya, a full-length dress many Muslim women wear."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...d706461fa4f_story.html?utm_term=.736e3975c2d6

So, IMHO, they came from the midnight prayers, ate and either a) were going back to attend the 2 am prayers, or b) were done with evening prayers and would be going home after eating but then fled back to the mosque.

Nabra’s mother, Sawsan Gazzar, said she thought Nabra and her friends would eat at the mosque after the prayers, and she would have forbidden her from walking to IHOP in the middle of the night. But she also wasn’t surprised that the girl went out; she and other teens had done it safely last year.


There was nothing in my post that addressed the crime statistics issue and that was directed at another member, to warrent you quoting me to post statistics on hate crime in the US. Please do not take the thread off topic.

relax guys. its not a debate at the Oxford Union.

I can understand that the issue should not be blown out of proportion and whatever the crime is should be condemned.

But why go in petty details if someone stayed out after the 2am deadline? How is that helping?

Please do tell out of curiosity. Virginia was considered quite safe for Pakistani or lets just say Brown expat, is the politics or the general rhetoric moving upwards from South Carolina?

Secondly these illegal aliens, what does the general public really actually want for them? I know nothing about El Salvador apart from their coffee and that one lady which i met years ago. Latinos are emotionally charged people so one can expect such a thing
 
From the Washington Post article:
"was assaulted and then disappeared after leaving a mosque in the Sterling area"
"According to accounts from police and a mosque official, a group of four or five teens were walking back from breakfast at IHOP early Sunday when they were confronted by a motorist. All but one of the teens ran to the mosque, where the group reported that the girl had been left behind,"
"Remains thought to be the girl’s were found about 3 p.m."
"Shoyeb Hassan, the co-chair of ADAMS, said that during the last 10 days of Ramadan, the mosque has extra prayers at midnight and 2 a.m., and members frequently go to McDonald’s or the 24-hour IHOP to eat before they start their fast at sunrise, as Nabra and her friends were doing."
"evening prayers, which ended about 12:30 a.m. Sunday. As they were pulling out of the parking lot, he said, he saw a group of teenagers congregating and talking loudly about going out to eat. The girls, he said, were wearing the abaya, a full-length dress many Muslim women wear."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...d706461fa4f_story.html?utm_term=.736e3975c2d6

So, IMHO, they came from the midnight prayers, ate and either a) were going back to attend the 2 am prayers, or b) were done with evening prayers and would be going home after eating but then fled back to the mosque.

Nabra’s mother, Sawsan Gazzar, said she thought Nabra and her friends would eat at the mosque after the prayers, and she would have forbidden her from walking to IHOP in the middle of the night. But she also wasn’t surprised that the girl went out; she and other teens had done it safely last year.

Irrespective of eating in or out is irrelevant. Here we have a teenager battered to death for no provocation on her part.

It's quite common for Muslims to be roaming very early hours either in or out off a Mosque during Ramadhan period. All of what you're suggesting from no angle makes it excusable for her life to be taken. To be quite frank various other sources differ to the actual nitty gritty facts on this heinous incident but the reality and factors that stand untouched are:

- Muslim teenager murdered with no provocation intended.

And quite rightly so her religion should be mentioned, had it been the other way round we all know the Headlines would be a different title.

No one wants Faith to be mentioned, but media should also imply the very same rule when a non-practicing, non-religious agnostic view holding misguided so-called 'Muslim' is gone on rampage. Why not keep a crime to a crime? Why bring in religion? Now you'd say because 'IS claim so' - Similarly to how many white-Supermacists are radicalised by media or a political party. Terrorism isn't barred to a specific faith.

relax guys. its not a debate at the Oxford Union.

I can understand that the issue should not be blown out of proportion and whatever the crime is should be condemned.

But why go in petty details if someone stayed out after the 2am deadline? How is that helping?

Please do tell out of curiosity. Virginia was considered quite safe for Pakistani or lets just say Brown expat, is the politics or the general rhetoric moving upwards from South Carolina?

Secondly these illegal aliens, what does the general public really actually want for them? I know nothing about El Salvador apart from their coffee and that one lady which i met years ago. Latinos are emotionally charged people so one can expect such a thing

Precisely! How is staying out late making it excusable? Absolutely irrelevant.
 
If Muslim do it it's Muslim terrorism and radical Islam but If Christian do it he is racist or mentally ill, now Muslims should take it seriously and call it Christian terrorism and extremist / radical Christianity.
 
relax guys. its not a debate at the Oxford Union.

I can understand that the issue should not be blown out of proportion and whatever the crime is should be condemned.

But why go in petty details if someone stayed out after the 2am deadline? How is that helping?

Please do tell out of curiosity. Virginia was considered quite safe for Pakistani or lets just say Brown expat, is the politics or the general rhetoric moving upwards from South Carolina?

Secondly these illegal aliens, what does the general public really actually want for them? I know nothing about El Salvador apart from their coffee and that one lady which i met years ago. Latinos are emotionally charged people so one can expect such a thing
I've lived in Virginia and it IS safe. But that does not preclude there being morons out there.

Irrespective of eating in or out is irrelevant. Here we have a teenager battered to death for no provocation on her part.
Well, no, if you claim things as fact then things should add up, and they do not. So, don't claim things as fact when you do not know the facts and can be shown to assume.

It's quite common for Muslims to be roaming very early hours either in or out off a Mosque during Ramadhan period. All of what you're suggesting from no angle makes it excusable for her life to be taken. To be quite frank various other sources differ to the actual nitty gritty facts on this heinous incident but the reality and factors that stand untouched are:

- Muslim teenager murdered with no provocation intended.

And quite rightly so her religion should be mentioned, had it been the other way round we all know the Headlines would be a different title.

No one wants Faith to be mentioned, but media should also imply the very same rule when a non-practicing, non-religious agnostic view holding misguided so-called 'Muslim' is gone on rampage. Why not keep a crime to a crime? Why bring in religion? Now you'd say because 'IS claim so' - Similarly to how many white-Supermacists are radicalised by media or a political party. Terrorism isn't barred to a specific faith.

Precisely! How is staying out late making it excusable? Absolutely irrelevant.
I was discussing things you claimed, like "going to mosque" while quite likely they were leaving: this to illustrate you do NOT know (ALL) the facts (and neither do I or anyone here)
I provided no excuses whatsoever. If you think I did quote the relevant text, I dare you. That's your claim, your accusation towards me.
Noone here said, suggested or implied not to mention faith > your projection.
Again you claim things you can't know "with no provication intended" > it remains as yet unclear what exactly happened.

Stick with the facts (most of which you do not know and cannot know, btw)

If Muslim do it it's Muslim terrorism and radical Islam but If Christian do it he is racist or mentally ill, now Muslims should take it seriously and call it Christian terrorism and extremist / radical Christianity.
You claim this. Your opinion, no supporting evidence/specific cases. IMHO just putting yourself/your group in the victim mode.

But why go in petty details if someone stayed out after the 2am deadline? How is that helping?
The investigation WILL go into such details. We don't have access to the investigation results. Yet some here pretend they do.
 
I've lived in Virginia and it IS safe. But that does not preclude there being morons out there.


Well, no, if you claim things as fact then things should add up, and they do not. So, don't claim things as fact when you do not know the facts and can be shown to assume.


I was discussing things you claimed, like "going to mosque" while quite likely they were leaving: this to illustrate you do NOT know (ALL) the facts (and neither do I or anyone here)
I provided no excuses whatsoever. If you think I did quote the relevant text, I dare you. That's your claim, your accusation towards me.
Noone here said, suggested or implied not to mention faith > your projection.
Again you claim things you can't know "with no provication intended" > it remains as yet unclear what exactly happened.

Stick with the facts (most of which you do not know and cannot know, btw)


You claim this. Your opinion, no supporting evidence/specific cases. IMHO just putting yourself/your group in the victim mode.

There is plenty evidence of Christian terrorism specially state sponsor one on Islamic countries.
 
If Muslim do it it's Muslim terrorism and radical Islam but If Christian do it he is racist or mentally ill, now Muslims should take it seriously and call it Christian terrorism and extremist / radical Christianity.

To be very fair no Christian ever does anything for religious motives. They've risen above that.
 
U.S. Crime Rate Rises Slightly, Remains Near 20-Year Low
A spike in murders – apparently driven by violence in Chicago, Baltimore and the nation's capital – drove an increase in violent crime in the U.S. in 2015, but crime overall still hovered near historic lows, the FBI said in its latest Crime in the United States report.
By Alan Neuhauser, Staff Writer | Sept. 26, 2016, at 10:30 a.m.
https://www.usnews.com/news/article...-rate-rises-slightly-remains-near-20-year-low

See also
https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-releases-2015-crime-statistics
https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/latest-crime-statistics-released

Fact Tank - Our Lives in Numbers
February 21, 2017
5 facts about crime in the U.S.
FT_17.02.15_crime_640px.png

  • Violent crime in the U.S. has fallen sharply over the past quarter century.
  • Property crime has declined significantly over the long term.
  • Public perceptions about crime in the U.S. often don’t align with the data
  • There are large geographic variations in crime rates.
  • Many crimes are not reported to police.

FT_16.11.16_crime_trend.png

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/21/5-facts-about-crime-in-the-u-s/


A couple of bits you missed out...

4There are large geographic variations in crime rates. The FBI’s data allow for geographic comparisons of crime rates, and these comparisons can show big differences from state to state and city to city. In 2015, for instance, there were more than 600 violent crimes per 100,000 residents in Alaska, Nevada, New Mexico and Tennessee. By contrast, Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont and Virginia had rates below 200 violent crimes per 100,000 residents. And while Chicago has drawn widespread attention for its soaring murder total in recent years, its murder rate in 2015 – 18 murders and non-negligent manslaughters per 100,000 residents – was less than a third of the rate in St. Louis (59 per 100,000) and Baltimore (55 per 100,000). The FBI notes that various factors might influence a particular area’s crime rate, including its population density and economic conditions.

5Many crimes are not reported to police. In its annual survey, BJS asks victims of crime whether or not they reported that crime to police. In 2015, the most recent year available, only about half of the violent crime tracked by BJS (47%) was reported to police. And in the much more common category of property crime, only about a third (35%) was reported. The proportion was substantially higher for offenses classified as serious violent crime (55%), a category that includes serious domestic violence (61% of which was reported), serious violent crime involving injury (59%) and serious violent crime involving weapons (56%). There are a variety of reasons why crime might not be reported, including a feeling that police “would not or could not do anything to help” or that the crime is “a personal issue or too trivial to report,” according to BJS.
 
I've lived in Virginia and it IS safe. But that does not preclude there being morons out there.


Well, no, if you claim things as fact then things should add up, and they do not. So, don't claim things as fact when you do not know the facts and can be shown to assume.


I was discussing things you claimed, like "going to mosque" while quite likely they were leaving: this to illustrate you do NOT know (ALL) the facts (and neither do I or anyone here)
I provided no excuses whatsoever. If you think I did quote the relevant text, I dare you. That's your claim, your accusation towards me.
Noone here said, suggested or implied not to mention faith > your projection.
Again you claim things you can't know "with no provication intended" > it remains as yet unclear what exactly happened.

Stick with the facts (most of which you do not know and cannot know, btw)


You claim this. Your opinion, no supporting evidence/specific cases. IMHO just putting yourself/your group in the victim mode.


The investigation WILL go into such details. We don't have access to the investigation results. Yet some here pretend they do.

With all due respect Sir, but I was referring to the mentioning of Faith by media - not you. Stating how the media radicalises and fuels hate - contributing nothing less than what ISIS does which works in their favour.

Facts such as she was murdered, had no previous link with this murderer and how he had just conveniently happens to have a baseball bat establishes quite a bit for any logical person.
 
With all due respect Sir, but I was referring to the mentioning of Faith by media - not you. Stating how the media radicalises and fuels hate - contributing nothing less than what ISIS does which works in their favour.

Facts such as she was murdered, had no previous link with this murderer and how he had just conveniently happens to have a baseball bat establishes quite a bit for any logical person.

Hold on Sherlock. Lets see what the investigation points out to.

I've lived in Virginia and it IS safe. But that does not preclude there being morons out there.


Well, no, if you claim things as fact then things should add up, and they do not. So, don't claim things as fact when you do not know the facts and can be shown to assume.


I was discussing things you claimed, like "going to mosque" while quite likely they were leaving: this to illustrate you do NOT know (ALL) the facts (and neither do I or anyone here)
I provided no excuses whatsoever. If you think I did quote the relevant text, I dare you. That's your claim, your accusation towards me.
Noone here said, suggested or implied not to mention faith > your projection.
Again you claim things you can't know "with no provication intended" > it remains as yet unclear what exactly happened.

Stick with the facts (most of which you do not know and cannot know, btw)


You claim this. Your opinion, no supporting evidence/specific cases. IMHO just putting yourself/your group in the victim mode.


The investigation WILL go into such details. We don't have access to the investigation results. Yet some here pretend they do.

Ofcourse i am not counting the anti social folks when i ask that.

But generally speaking in America people live accordingly.

I remember in the 80s Jackson heights dilemma New Yorkers faced.

But i was mostly asking how the general public are. Everyone minds there own business ofcourse but is the typical southern mentality taken over?

Given a choice would you and sorry for a personal question. Would you pick Virginia over Texas?
 
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