1990/01/19 and the Kashmiri Pandits

[jamahir]

Hello, I clicked the TV remote onto a Right-leaning news channel and they were saying that today ( the 19th of January 2020 ) is the 30th anniversary of the beginning of the driving away of Kashmiri Pandits from their homes by Muslim militants.

The Wikipedia page for "Panun Kashmir" states this :

Approximately 300,000 to 600,000 Kashmiri Hindus fled Kashmir due to rising Islamic terrorism in Kashmir. However, Panun Kashmir estimates nearly 700,000 refugees

Whatever the number, successive national governments of India have failed in giving the Pandits proper homes and from what I know, many of them live in slums in Delhi. Perhaps these governments have also used the displaced Pandits as a tool.

I am not Right-leaning yet I believe that the Kashmiri Pandits should be allowed to return to their Kashmiri homeland. Part of the problems in the Kashmir valley will end.

This is my simple message.

---
@Joe Shearer @jbgt90 @The_Showstopper and others.

 

[Asimzranger]

 

[masterchief_mirza]

My understanding is that most Kashmiris themselves want Pandits to return, but not at the expense of their own freedoms. If certain pandit communities have conspired with Delhi to disenfranchise Kashmiris and dissolve the hard earned rights of indigenous Kashmiris, those particular Pandits cannot be regarded as loyal Kashmiris and leave themselves open to fair criticism and fair designation as traitors to Kashmir.

 

[jamahir]

My understanding is that most Kashmiris themselves want Pandits to return, but not at the expense of their own freedoms.

As I meant in the OP, if the Pandits return to the Valley, it may signal a gradual demilitarization of the Valley.

My understanding is that most Kashmiris themselves want Pandits to return

I think you are right.

How so ??

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Before hindus jump on my comment, such a measure of loyalty is applied regardless of religious affiliation. Plenty of Muslims have betrayed the kashmiri cause also.

The interesting point is that both kashmiri Hindus and Muslims have simply been exploited by Hindutva. Pandits have been used as tools by Delhi to malign the kashmiri independence movement as some kind of religious or communal war. Kashmiri Muslims have also been used and deceived, take the Abdullah dynasty in particular. How foolish they now feel, openly favouring misplaced loyalty to Delhi instead of the interests of their own people. Now they languish under arrest without charge, simply for being Muslim and powerful locally, ergo a potential threat. Muslims will always have their wings clipped by Delhi, no matter how much Pooja they do.

 

[Imran Khan]

if we see hindu fascist terrorists of BJP/RSS today then its same thing they are doing today with others

 

[jamahir]

Before hindus jump on my comment, such a measure of loyalty is applied regardless of religious affiliation. Plenty of Muslims have betrayed the kashmiri cause also.

The interesting point is that both kashmiri Hindus and Muslims have simply been exploited by Hindutva. Pandits have been used as tools by Delhi to malign the kashmiri independence movement as some kind of religious or communal war. Kashmiri Muslims have also been used and deceived, take the Abdullah dynasty in particular. How foolish they now feel, openly favouring misplaced loyalty to Delhi instead of the interests of their own people. Now they languish under arrest without charge, simply for being Muslim and powerful locally, ergo a potential threat. Muslims will always have their wings clipped by Delhi, no matter how much Pooja they do.

1. I don't think the Abdullah family had a misguided attachment with Delhi. Perhaps they simply were skeptical of what system would be installed on the Valley if, say theoretically, the Valley were to cede to Pakistan.

2. Even without talking of suppression by the Indian armed forces in Kashmir, there have been of late local Regressive elements existing within the Muslim community there. Asiya Andrabi, the full burqa-and-glove-clad chief of the all-female burqa group Dukhtaraan-e-Millat has been able to achieve a certain influence there. To me comes to mind that some years ago, an three-member all-women Kashmiri music band called Pargaash was forced to close down because of threats by the Regressive elements.

3. What needs to be in Kashmir is the influence of Kashmiri Progressives like Shehla Rashid, M.Y. Tarigami and even the Abdullah father and son.

4. The wider Kashmir issue is no doubt more than something local to India. For peace to settle within the Kashmir Valley - (a). Both India and Pakistan need to become governed by the same Progressive political system much like how pre-2003 Iraq and Syria were governed by the Ba'ath movement yet remained two independent republics, (b). The LoC should be converted into an International Border passable by passport for reasons of trade, tourism and family visits. These two things will stop most of the militancy within the Kashmir Valley. The militancy that will remain will be of the terrorist type and that can be resolved as a common problem of both India and Pakistan.

5. Not all Kashmiri Muslims hate India. For example, once every year a Kashmiri clothing seller comes to my house. There are Kashmiri handicrafts sellers throughout the country. There are students, actors etc from Kashmir.

 

[Crixus]

Karma is a bitch

if we see hindu fascist terrorists of BJP/RSS today then its same thing they are doing today with others

 

[Lincoln]

Hello, I clicked the TV remote onto a Right-leaning news channel and they were saying that today ( the 19th of January 2020 ) is the 30th anniversary of the beginning of the driving away of Kashmiri Pandits from their homes by Muslim militants.

The Wikipedia page for "Panun Kashmir" states this :


Whatever the number, successive national governments of India have failed in giving the Pandits proper homes and from what I know, many of them live in slums in Delhi. Perhaps these governments have also used the displaced Pandits as a tool.

I am not Right-leaning yet I believe that the Kashmiri Pandits should be allowed to return to their Kashmiri homeland. Part of the problems in the Kashmir valley will end.

This is my simple message.

---
@Joe Shearer @jbgt90 @The_Showstopper and others.

What about the over a million Muslims driven off from Jammu and slaughtered in Kashmir during '47 by the king to quickly change the demographic.

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Hello, I clicked the TV remote onto a Right-leaning news channel and they were saying that today ( the 19th of January 2020 ) is the 30th anniversary of the beginning of the driving away of Kashmiri Pandits from their homes by Muslim militants.

The Wikipedia page for "Panun Kashmir" states this :


Whatever the number, successive national governments of India have failed in giving the Pandits proper homes and from what I know, many of them live in slums in Delhi. Perhaps these governments have also used the displaced Pandits as a tool.

I am not Right-leaning yet I believe that the Kashmiri Pandits should be allowed to return to their Kashmiri homeland. Part of the problems in the Kashmir valley will end.

This is my simple message.

---
@Joe Shearer @jbgt90 @The_Showstopper and others.

How about Jammu's refugees should be resetteled in Jammu

 

[Lincoln]

1. I don't think the Abdullah family had a misguided attachment with Delhi. Perhaps they simply were skeptical of what system would be installed on the Valley if, say theoretically, the Valley were to cede to Pakistan.

2. Even without talking of suppression by the Indian armed forces in Kashmir, there have been of late local Regressive elements existing within the Muslim community there. Asiya Andrabi, the full burqa-and-glove-clad chief of the all-female burqa group Dukhtaraan-e-Millat has been able to achieve a certain influence there. To me comes to mind that some years ago, an three-member all-women Kashmiri music band called Pargaash was forced to close down because of threats by the Regressive elements.

3. What needs to be in Kashmir is the influence of Kashmiri Progressives like Shehla Rashid, M.Y. Tarigami and even the Abdullah father and son.

4. The wider Kashmir issue is no doubt more than something local to India. For peace to settle within the Kashmir Valley - (a). Both India and Pakistan need to become governed by the same Progressive political system much like how pre-2003 Iraq and Syria were governed by the Ba'ath movement yet remained two independent republics, (b). The LoC should be converted into an International Border passable by passport for reasons of trade, tourism and family visits. These two things will stop most of the militancy within the Kashmir Valley. The militancy that will remain will be of the terrorist type and that can be resolved as a common problem of both India and Pakistan.

5. Not all Kashmiri Muslims hate India. For example, once every year a Kashmiri clothing seller comes to my house. There are Kashmiri handicrafts sellers throughout the country. There are students, actors etc from Kashmir.

4. Not possible, how about give people the rights promised to them, that it is to vote for and decide their fate.

5. Many immigrants work in countries and study, but they don't like 'em. So you don't have a point here.

 

[jamahir]

What about the over a million Muslims driven off from Jammu and slaughtered in Kashmir during '47 by the king to quickly change the demographic.

How about Jammu's refugees should be resetteled in Jammu

We should adopt the model that Mandela created in South Africa after he was released from jail. He helped set up the Truth and Reconciliation Commission which brought a closure to crimes committed during the Apartheid era. Let bygones be bygones.

Any Muslims driven off Jammu and alive now should be resettled in the Valley. They would feel safer there.

5. Many immigrants work in countries and study, but they don't like 'em. So you don't have a point here.

But I am telling you. These merchants, students, actors etc are not virulently against India. However I agree that the students among them have faced certain problems.

 

[Lincoln]

We should adopt the model that Mandela created in South Africa after he was released from jail. He helped set up the Truth and Reconciliation Commission which brought a closure to crimes committed during the Apartheid era. Let bygones be bygones.

Any Muslims driven off Jammu and alive now should be resettled in the Valley. They would feel safer there.



What are these rights ??



But I am telling you. These merchants, students, actors etc are not virulently against India. However I agree that the students among them have faced certain problems.

You're telling me based on personal experience. Nobody is mad at anyone personally.

And the right is self determination right, right to determine their fate.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

1. I don't think the Abdullah family had a misguided attachment with Delhi. Perhaps they simply were skeptical of what system would be installed on the Valley if, say theoretically, the Valley were to cede to Pakistan.

2. Even without talking of suppression by the Indian armed forces in Kashmir, there have been of late local Regressive elements existing within the Muslim community there. Asiya Andrabi, the full burqa-and-glove-clad chief of the all-female burqa group Dukhtaraan-e-Millat has been able to achieve a certain influence there. To me comes to mind that some years ago, an three-member all-women Kashmiri music band called Pargaash was forced to close down because of threats by the Regressive elements.

3. What needs to be in Kashmir is the influence of Kashmiri Progressives like Shehla Rashid, M.Y. Tarigami and even the Abdullah father and son.

4. The wider Kashmir issue is no doubt more than something local to India. For peace to settle within the Kashmir Valley - (a). Both India and Pakistan need to become governed by the same Progressive political system much like how pre-2003 Iraq and Syria were governed by the Ba'ath movement yet remained two independent republics, (b). The LoC should be converted into an International Border passable by passport for reasons of trade, tourism and family visits. These two things will stop most of the militancy within the Kashmir Valley. The militancy that will remain will be of the terrorist type and that can be resolved as a common problem of both India and Pakistan.

5. Not all Kashmiri Muslims hate India. For example, once every year a Kashmiri clothing seller comes to my house. There are Kashmiri handicrafts sellers throughout the country. There are students, actors etc from Kashmir.

With respect, you're cherry picking history.

 

[jamahir]

You're telling me based on personal experience. Nobody is mad at anyone personally.

Ok.

And the right is self determination right, right to determine their fate.

Then tell me practically, will the Indian establishment agree to a plebiscite in the Valley ??

What I proposed not only will resolve the Kashmir issue but will also, at the same time, bring Progressive system to both India and Pakistan.

With respect, you're cherry picking history.

Where ??